RTO is slated to start from next Monday, has anyone actually been mandated to be present in the office by their direct manager or has it died a quick death as usual?
46 replies (most recent on top)
@1ak changing the job location (due to "business reasons") is perfectly legal under UK law. If the new location was within the UK they'd have to offer you your job in the new location (no relocation costs but you'd get a tapered travel allowance over two years).
However if the job moved outside of the UK then they don't have to offer you the job.
Understand that multi national corporations have been playing labour arbitrage for a very long time and that we always are only employed until a cheaper method can be found.
We're all pretty determined to get the clients to switch supplier so we can get that one last pay check with a capped redundancy sooner rather than later now.
@17z totally agree but they lie about this all the time and no one can prove it either way.
I know of someone made redundant years ago on the basis that the organisation they we in did not want people in said country anymore and not that the position was gone - HR were fully behind this redundancy logic. They can make it up as they go along in my eyes, remember you are just a number in the end to be discarded when it suits - loyalty is a waste of time unless you are waiting for a nice redundancy package :)
@w9 remember though IF they make you redundant its the position they make redundant and not the person therefore they cannot hire somebody to replace you
@14e Why does it make any difference to you? You clearly don’t work for DXC anymore. Are you just bitter because you left, and the rest of your team got redundancy for putting up with it a little longer? As you say yourself—move on! Stop checking this site.
If you are an employee, you’re surely deluded if you think it’s a great place to work and that everyone else should feel the same. We all have our reasons for staying—mostly waiting for redundancy.
Oh stop bi--hing, CSC ,HPE and now DXC has been the same for 10+ years. If you don’t like your employer then why do you stay?
You stay because you can’t get hired anywhere else ! So shut up, do the job you are paid for , or leave SIMPLE
@11e The good people gave up fighting management’s determination to crash this company a long time ago. Those still here aren’t looking for another job — they don’t want one. We’ve already made our money, and now it’s just a case of rinsing what’s left while it lasts.
The real game is how unbearable management can make things, and how long people will put up with it. Personally, I can see sticking it out through the winter — but not another five years.
If the company dropped the constant “we might have to let people go!” threat so we can't justify a pay rise, they’d probably find many would stop holding out.
@z4 No one started back in the office, it is a dead duck and they know it.
what a bunch of losers.
when you are out of work..bleating about AI taking jobs..
dreaming a 25 mike commute to office would be least of your problems lol
suprise suprise lot of talk midland and north uk moaning..because of you lot company in a mess UK..
The miserly pay increase amounts for those who do get them are so small and extremely rare that the cost of the commute over the year would be more than the value of any reward. That stick is not going to work either, there is very little carrot that I can see which is going to shift the opinion on this one for most.
Legally, if you are a virtual worker, eg your home / remote is your contracted location, they cannot just force you into the office. What they CAN do is make you redundant, but depending on your service there and T&Cs that might be even costlier
I knew some folk in the Midlands who got told they were going to be expected to drive to Erskine regularly, told their manager to F off, and nothing further came of it
Yes, they cannot make you sign a new contract of employment BUT they can make ongoing employment difficult. I was in a management position many years ago and told to sign a new CSC contract (was BAE) or promotion / pay rise wouldn't be an option.
I chose to leave the business.
To be fair, promotions and pay rises are almost non existent unless they can directly tie you to money. I've seen people who have left and then come back on better terms, or more often people who leave for the client on better terms
I knew ONE guy who got a pay rise from £30k > £45k, and that was literally because losing him would've meant no bid proposals being carried forward because he was the only one doing it at the time (nobody with clearance / access or knowledge to cover) = massive service penalties and loss of income from said bidding. The guy still had to hand in his notice with a rival offer from elsewhere to get it though
Yes, they cannot make you sign a new contract of employment BUT they can make ongoing employment difficult. I was in a management position many years ago and told to sign a new CSC contract (was BAE) or promotion / pay rise wouldn't be an option.
I chose to leave the business.
How many people actually started back in this week? Or are the people who do, just not the sort of people who would use this site. They obviously love DXC and will do whataver it asks, usually in their own time and at their own expense!!
@xe Most people already have. Sit out a redundancy. Play the system. Grumble on here as nobody listens internally. But least we know it's not just our tiny team that hates DXC.
This whole deal is nuts. A manager i know is being required to travel into work and lives well over 25miles away from an office. They recently tried to get everyone from 2 accounts in the office and all of 6 people showed up. This is out of about 400 people within range of an office.
This will force people to make employment decisions sooner than later.
If you’re in the UK DXC must follow the ACAS procedures shown here for changing employment contracts: https://www.acas.org.uk/changing-an-employment-contract/employer-responsibilities/if-employment-contract-changes-cannot-be-agreed
@w2 exactly what the previous poster said. Either they require you to sign a new contract changing the terms or they lay you off (aka make you redundant). If you follow the threads around here for any length of time, I think there will be a queue for the latter option in countries with proper redundancy terms.
@vy they of course can't "make you", but they absolutely can decide they're changing the terms of your contract, and they absolutely can make you redudant if you refuse to sign the new one. Doesn't mean it's right - it's just what will happen.
@vj Think you'll find they cannot make you sign anything (that would be against the law). The can of course give you a choice of, full time option of returning to the office or lay you off (not fire you, as that would be constructive dismissal), but certainly cannot make you sign anything against your will.
Again to point it out, the mail from DA clearly states it is not a mandate. You can understand why, they do not have the office space, they will be in breach of health and safety without providing monitors, keyboards, etc for everyone (same as they had to ensure you had all this equipment at home for virtual first) all ignoring that people will simply refuse to go in en masse given the cost of living increases and lack for increments from DXC. It is doomed to failure.
@jh and ‘if it involved a fatal accident’ this has happened to a member of staff previously. So beware.
@k3 might be worth re-reading that contract - they can't make you RTO full time but they almost certainly can mandate some office time. They could also just make you sign a new office work contract and fire you if you refuse.
Make Useless S Brockillhurst CEO, then the company can be wound up quickly, shorten the misery and pain.
@pd They’re not totally clueless—they’re making a tidy profit for themselves steering this ship. The problem is selfishness: nobody else is seeing the rewards. DXC isn’t something that will be handed down through the generations, that’s for sure.
Rinse and discard!!
@k3 And to be fair, they are well aware of this, which is why it's not mandatory and why they said the will pay expenses, which is also why it will be total failure, there's no money to pay for any travel, hence the long standing travel ban. DXC leadership are clueless and completely divorced from the reality they've created
@m7 Being this incompetent is a unique skill that only DXC recognises and rewards.
When they have their time wasting meetings they have to come up with something.
They have to justify their fake positions.
Instead of spending time on winning new business its easier to come up with pie in the sky ideas.
They made me sign a contract stating I am a virtual worker. They can't make me go into an office for whatever reason.
@hw easy answer to this hassle, the mail from DA stated it is not a mandate.
@hn Very good points.
I suspect they are banking that you are prepared to use your own private car to take the business trip to/from the office twice a week. As you correctly point out you are technically not insured if you are involved in an accident during this trip without business grade insurance - you can be sure DXC execs have not thought that one through. You would be crazy to proceed using this method especially if it involved a fatal accident where a much more rigorous investigation would take place.
So really the only options for travel the company requires you to undertake is public transport of some sorts (taxi, rail, bus) or car hire on DXC's own insurance. DXC will "demand" you take the cheapest option (bus or rail) which will also generally be the slowest, and given you are on a business trip the travel duration counts as part of your working day. Say 8 hour working day, 1.5 hours travel in, 5 hours in office, 1.5 hours travel home and finally same day an expense claim submitted for the travel cost. Again this has been wonderfully thought through at the exec level.
"Their job is to hassle you into going."
This is 100% what DXC is all about - make silly changes to p*ss off people AKA shaking the tree to make you leave
Apparently the spreadsheet is a power bi app which shows a manager who is in range.
Their job is to hassle you into going.
Presumably they get in trouble if they don't succeed. So as usual it's down to how much they engage with corporate policy...
@fx 25 miles as the crow flies (shortest) or 25 miles in a taxi (probably middling) or 25 miles on public transport (typically the longest if there is no direct route A to B). What exactly is in the spreadsheet?
@gz note in many countries your private car insurance is for social and domestic use. You must pay extra to use it for business purposes (i.e. a business trip). Most folks are not insured to do this drive while claiming mileage.
www .keithmichaels.co.uk/news/do-i-need-business-car-insurance-to-claim-mileage/
Everyone just go into Newcastle. Claim your expenses at 45p a mile. Book a cheap hotel 25 miles away. Which you can also claim travel for. It's what they want!!
Either it will accelerate the company going bust. Or they will refuse to pay it and you can refuse to complete your project until the dispute is resolved.
Range is 25 miles
@fb What exactly is "in range"?
Subsequently how do they batter you, given it is entirely optional? Do they keep begging you to turn up at their expense? Genuine questions...
I learnt today that the spreadsheet actually exists... If you are "in range" of an office you will get battered for not turning up...
Step one might have been to ask managers to bring their teams together in person once a quarter. But there’s been no effort to make this a meaningful strategy. They probably don’t want you to turn up, but you can be sure they’ll use it as an excuse to say you don’t qualify for a pay rise this year.
@b1 Hasn't it gone quiet?
Not even the nausea inducing pre-recorded propaganda news room nonsense. Can anyone remember the last time a leader actually held a town hall that wasn't pre-recorded or didn't have a customer or partner in?
You know one where they might actually have to answer tricky questions from staff. Instead of questions like "where's our pay rise you lying two face bar-stewards?" they get to watch partners answer questions like "Why are you called Boomi?"
@b0 and most of us are on Virtual First contracts. So saying that travel expenses won’t be paid is just nonsense and outrageous so it will not work in its current state. Also, on a different topic. Merit pay increases were promised for Oct this year and this has also gone very quiet as well as comms from our CEO. The last town hall was in April. Is he still around?????
There are not enough offices or space in current offices for this to work in the UK. Badly thought out to ask this now. If they really wanted this to work. Spend money. Open more offices with decent facilities/equipment and actually give employees a valid reason to go in. Don’t just say let’s test the water so we can work out if money should be spent.