Thread regarding Chevron Corp. layoffs

Not sure I understand the incessant focus on people taking (getting) what's not deserved, as if the only function of government is to redistribute wealth. The fact is it is government supported order, security, and infrastructure that separates the first world from the third world. I am productive because I work hard, but also because things work around me... the lights stay on, the sewers don't back up, and I do not need a security detail in order to commute home. I work just as hard in various locations overseas and get a lot less done, because the infrastructure systems there do not work. The relevance to the discussion here is that if we have a completely disfunctional fit nothing government it is going to be bad for us all (eventually), not just some mythical group of "takers". Inefficient ineffective health care systems are bad for everyone.

1hycx, Welcome to the Internet, expresssions such as "Crickets" and "LMAO" are commonly used all over the place, on this forum and elsewhere. Since this is evidently your first time on a forum, I suggest that you Google a list of common Internet & text abbreviations. like LOL, IIRC, LMAO, ROTFL, YMMV, etc. There are many and they are used by many. It doesn't mean it's the same user unless you are truly dense and naive. Many people use an expression back at someone, in ridicule.

I don't know about you guys, but I don't sit around wondering what Congress is going to pass or not pass to enable me to get something from someone else's tax dollars. I understood at an early age that you need to work to support yourself, be independent and buy things that you want, including the necessities. I couldn't give a flying flip about what Congress does or doesn't do, Democrat or Republican, one is as bad as the next. I doubt many people who work or got laid off from Chevron would wait or even pray for handouts instead of doing whatever he/she can to provide for themselves and family either. Consider yourselves a small minority if you are sitting around waiting for government to help you or even "hoping" that they pass something that allows you to receive benefits that you did not earn, simply because someone falsely thinks that certain privileged people are "owed" something and magically have a "right" to something others earned or worked hard to provide, like medical and hospitalization services. That was unheard of when I was growing up.

@1hxpw - Wait, you put "... Crickets ..." at the end of your own post. So you expected people to respond to it before you posted it? LMAO (as you like to say).

1howq, Yes indeed, maybe one day you can be a complete parasitic sponge leeching off of the nanny state instead of just a partial parasite. All you get now is free health care subsidized by others while you contribute little to nothing and never did, stay classy and keep blaming Trump and the Republicans for all of your ills! - LMAO!!!

"Well there's a lot of things going on in the country right now"... that may well be. However most presidents get a brief honeymoon period (the first hundred days to a year) when they get a chance to set an agenda to do something big. Obama choice was health care and immigrant reform, but as his honeymoon was ending he decided to let immigration slide so as to focus on healthcare. Trump has done nothing except some presidential directives and aimless tweets, and he blames the House for not getting health care done even though it was he who decided to put that up first, before tax reform. At this point I expect him to continue to flounder until midterms, when the Republicans are likely to lose the Senate (just as Obama did during the first half of his first term). For those who want reforms of the ACA (or replace), you are likely to have a long wait! The Democratics are starting to beat their single payer drum again, so there may come a day when the Republicans wish they had pulled up their pants and make the free-market-based ACA work.

1hnzt, Yes you're right, though I think it's been established that Time magazine leans left as do most publications like that. Not sure about Fortune. Too many ads for me and the ad-blocker thing bans it. I wonder why they would think that the new ACA revisions could be proposed and passed without a similar level of debate, criticism, revisions etc. All the pundits and talking heads are talking about them not getting anything done on it as if it should be a one-week ordeal or something. Well there's a lot of things going on in the country right now which undoubtedly take precedence. Just hope they fix this abomination before the country is completely broke. Meanwhile, I'm happy to have real insurance instead, at a decent rate.

"Cherry pick your left-wing bent propaganda articles"... ya those comee rags like Fortune and Time ... ignoring completely the definitive sources like Breitbart and Limbaugh.

@NYl0bIP-1hott, Keep on trying to rewrite history dear, and by all means don't let facts get in your way. Keep up the insults in true liberal fashion, and spouting off hatred and vitriol, which caused you to lose, your opponents love it!!! And feel free to cherry pick your left-wing bent propaganda articles and don't put anything in quotation marks so the simpleton's reading this will think you are a member of the liberal pseudo-intellectual elite as you cut and paste and/or paraphrase left-wing propaganda. I don't waste my time with false narratives which twist and bend reality in vain to try to support an impossible view, as the articles you quote do, as do many of the left's false narratives. I love the effort though, dear.

Now - How many REPUBLICAN members of Congress voted for the Affordable Care Act, you know, the one that (you claim) all participated in the development of and virtually created, since (as you claim) it's basis was RomneyCare (a failure, but a common meaningless liberal talking point)

Please enlighten us, dear scholar, after all of Congress read the ~2000 page bill again, HOW MANY Republicans, who all came to this miraculous compromise( as you claim) with the almighty Obama and his democrats who developed it behind closed doors , voted for this "compromise" bill?

.....Crickets.....

1hmmk, you are an idiot and a self-centered, self-serving envious, selfish braggart. . You can't even make it through a post without using the term "trumpolite" and telling everyone how deluded you are about your self-perceived monetary success, which no one here can confirm anyway. None of your ridiculous rant makes any sense or has any basis in facts, and I happen to be a center-left to liberal, not that should make any difference. I didn't vote for Trump but people like you deserve him and are the reason he is in office.

It is a very hard problem, not caused by freeloaders, wet backs sneeking into the system, or any other faceless "other" (eval drug companies) but by medical practice getting more and more expensive as new technology (including science, machines, and drugs) can extend our life but at an ever increasing cost. Those countries that spend less and get more (measured by, for example, longer average life) focus on good health and prevention. The USA spends the least on prevention and a huge amount on major intervention in what is typically the last year of life. We get a lot less bang for the buck that way, on average. When it is you or yours, however, no expense is too great. Unless we can balance that square peg (I demand the best even if the outcome of more treatment is unlikely to improve life) with that round hole (you or someone else has to pay for it) we are never going to have a functioning health care system. For those who say I got mine (I earned it!) have the great unwashed get their own, I always wonder how many of those folks could pay for something really catastrophic... let's say 15 yr of advanced Alzheimer's care at $80k a year...would you sit on the street when your money ran out or belly up to the public trough like the rest of us sinners. As a final note, before the Trumpolites start up, I am independently wealthy after 30 yrs at Chevron (ending grade 28) and have never taken a dime of aid from anyone... so bugger off on that front.

@1hott - Excellent summary of the history and situation with respect to the ACA. Unfortunately, it's much easier for some people to criticize others and listen uncritically to the propaganda they like than it is to actually try to understand a complex issue. Unfortunately, the current administration is more than happy to take advantage of these tendencies.

-1gwnh: I do not know if your ignorant or just full of partisan propaganda. Were you around when the ACA passed? Did you ever watch the news? The fact is the Democrats were arguing for single payer (since before Bill Clinton, which would have been more efficient, but it was never clear how they would control costs) and the Republicans wanted a system in which free enterprise would bring efficiency to the system (but again it was not clear exactly how). The ACA was to be a compromise, and as far as I am concerned the republicans mostly got their way (ACA = RomneyCare). Thus it not much surprise that they have little to add at this point. No one supports your idea that the poor should use emergency rooms for their primary care … that is the least cost effective idea around. As too the ACA not being debated, that is just simply historical revisionism in it most rank form.

The ACA made it out of committee in the House of Representatives in July 2009, after a month-long markup and 160 Republican amendments. The House didn’t vote on it until November 7th. In 2010, the Senate health committee spent nearly 60 hours over the course of 13 days marking up the legislation that would become the ACA. The Senate Finance Committee held 53 meetings about the ACA and an eight-day markup of the bill, which was the longest markup for the committee in over 20 years. The committee considered 130 amendments and held 79 roll-call votes. There were 44 hearings and public events about the plan in the Senate alone, The bill was signed into law in March 2010, 8 months after it emerged from committee in the House."

http://fortune.com/2017/06/27/ahca-less-public-debate-than-aca/

“The Affordable Care Act bill was subject to 47 public hearings and roundtable before the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee and another 53 before the Senate Finance Committee. Prior to a vote, the Affordable Care Act underwent a monthlong marking up in the bipartisan HELP Committee before being brought to the floor for a vote. There, it was debated for 25 days—one of the longest periods of bill debate the Senate has ever seen. The bipartisan HELP Committee approved more than 100 Republican amendments to the bill.” http://time.com/4827115/health-care-bill-senate-republicans-obamacare-criticism/

I will NEVER vote for an establishment politician again. Not a Democrat or Republican ever again. These "establishment" type politicians are opposing forces, which means nothing will get done while things around us get worse. I will vote ONLY for true independents with good ideas and Democrats or Republicans who were never in office before and bring forth excellent plans and the willingness to give and take. In politics today, most of the incumbents think of themselves first, getting re-elected and staying away from controversial problems that need solving. I also pledge to vote against any politician who tries to run for a third term. Two terms is enough before having to pass the baton.

@NYl0bIP-1gjvw, You stated: "The fact is they never explained their "great new plan" to the public to get buyin...never had a single public meeting on their revised health care plan ... and could not even get their own folks to buy in."

That's you perfectly describing the proposal and passage by Congress of the ACA by the Democrats, in light of the fact that among the general public, according to polls, over 60% of Americans polled were against the passage of the ACA, AKA "Obamacare".

Was that what you were intending to describe, the passage of Obamacare? There's a big difference, though, the Democrats are much quicker, whimsical and capricious in passing a bill that the general public dislikes. They are much better at cramming something down the throats of Americans that they do not like nor want. It's a shame that Republicans in Congress can't be more like democrats in that regard.

Contrary to commonly repeated liberal falsehoods, healthcare and HI costs were NOT spiraling out of control prior to the introduction of the ACA, which was introduced before it was passed, at least not nearly as much as they are today. And all Americans had access to emergency care as they do today..

The republicans currently have majorities in all branches of the government... if they can not pass anything with that then they never will. The fact is they never explained their "great new plan" to the public to get buyin...never had a single public meeting on their revised health care plan ... and could not even get their own folks to buy in. That was because the plan was worse than ACA by all measures. It is well known that the problem is systemic cost control, and until there is a real plan (by someone, anyone) that has any potential to impact that I figure we will stay with an unstable ACA and out of control rising costs for everyone else!

@1goxg, It's true the majority of the ACA plans don't serve very well, but like needles in a haystack, there are a few that shine. The one I'm with is not a national insurer, but regional. It doesn't cost be but $82 a month and is heavily subsidized to the tune of $1,210. I have a fantastic PCP Doctor near my home and access to hundreds of top knock specialists and hospitals. My maximum out of pocket is capped at $1,250 per year. I'm not knocking the ACA because it does work best for me.

What does all this political BS have to do with retiree insurance vs other options? Would you guys please stick to the topic. There's nothing that Congress can do with the Democrats opposing everything that the Republicans propose then blaming them for not getting anything done and vice versa, as was stated earlier, agreed.

In any event, I had insurance through the exchanges last year, silver plan and ended up paying more after all the actual medical expenses from my HSA than the retiree insurance, which I ended up switching to. I do not need to see the doctor but once a year and update my high cholesterol meds and a couple others, normally, but I ended up paying more through the ACA exchanges anyway, I couldn't believe it. I have Chevron retiree now and the cost looks a little higher on paper, but after expenses, couple of doctors visits, Express-Scripts, etc, you end up the same or paying less with the Chevron retiree plan. And the service is leaps and bounds better because you have a normal plan. God forbid that you have something come up as many do in their older years and you are stuck with one of those bronze or even silver plans. That would be no cakewalk. Just my experience, not trying to push it on anyone.

@NYl0bIP-1glcu, You are not stating the entire problem though. The democrats would have no problem working with the republicans if they would only compromise, and I hear every liberal talk show host and many guest lecturers state it the same way so I know it's true. They state it very clearly that the Republicans "do not know the meaning of compromise" and proceed to explain. You know - to compromise with the left - to give them what they want..,, Everything that the democrats have on the table. All the "uncompromising republicans" have to do is yield to "everything that the democrats ask for" and everything will be all peachy keen - LMAO! But they "don't know how to compromise" Too funny!

You can't make this stuff up if you tried, I tell ya. Keep em coming Hillary fans. You can help her promote her book too - Everyone in Congress, all of Washington, the DNC, the RNC personnel, Russia, Wikileaks, Fox news, CNN, her staff, Trumps staff, you name them - ALL responsible for her losing the election. Everyone but the voters - LOL. hold on, I'll get some popcorn.

-1gxgv, Yes, nice comment, but also thanks for letting everyone know that you are a pathetic whining never-ending complaining Hillary voter with limitless excuses for why the ACA is a failure and parrot the false narrative about Congress. Now magically somehow the Republicans, not one of which casted a vote for, are responsible for the ACA's woes. After all you are one of the liberals who prefer to take from others instead of contributing to society, - you receive said government assistance. And you give even more excuses for why the Obstructionist ~48% Democrat house and senate do absolutely NOTHING that they are being paid for since last November. But yet, of course, it's perfectly fine for Democrats in the House and senate to take a 4 year vacation in the eyes of a liberal. That's not much more than they do in any case. The tiny majority that the Republicans have in Congress grants the dems the right to just sit there and do nothing for the remainder of their terms and complain about nothing getting done - that's rich!

-1egbo: good on you, ya know how to get all the Trumptards frothing. The problem is with the law, which needs to be amended, but can't be because it is hung (like everything else) in the do nothing House controlled by the republicans. Eight years they shouted that they had a better way, but when they stepped up to the plate it was all limp...go figure. Now it's tax reform, but once again no explanation of "the plan".. if you can not ever figure out how to use it it does eventually fall off;-).

@NYl0bIP-1fhlq, People on Welfare and Foodstamps and other forms of government assistance in the U.S. generally blow it on things like prime beef and lobsters then complain about the handouts not being enough or it not satisfying their insatiable urge to parasite off others instead of being real men who support themselves. Join the club. You just have a place online to complain with the rest of the asshurt losers like yourself. You fit in well with the rest of the laid-off inbreds who post on this site.

1fhlq, I eat what I want when I want. travel where I want, when I want. And am not on Obamacare, and am not working for the likes of pathetic losers like yourself, nor do I pay taxes which support you and your miserable, pathetic, parasitic, pseudo-successful, pathetic, vengeful and hateful, lifestyle in my retirement location. I worked hard and invested properly to be financially independent, unlike you, who made poor decisions earlier in life and are a dependent parasite. You apparently have a small-prick complex also because you keep posting on this site, it couldn't be that you feel pathetically incapable, incompetent and unsuccessful simply because you rely on government assistance to live your lifestyle, because you keep ranting about how you sleep so well at night after stealing from others less fortunate than you.

@1fmhf, Pardon me as I bottom feed off all the prime beef and succulent lobster I can stomach. And stop browsing this site and get back to work. We "parasites" need your tax dollars rolling in to help pay our Obamacare subsidies into 2018 and beyond. Get now. Chop chop.

That's because both of you are laid off butthurt losers without a life trolling this site. Do-nothing pieces of deadwood. None of you work for a living. I don't need Obamadon'tcare. I happen to have a job that I love and wouldn't give it up for the world, all the vacation that I can use. Not at Chevron. I certainly hope that I don't end up like you guys. Pathetic and miserable.

@NYl0bIP-1egbo, Yes, you are correct, my mistake. Neanderthals like you will generally always be parasitic leechs on society and mooch off others without carrying their share of the load and never evolve into humans. Bottom-feeding low-lifes with disregard for others and no conscience and no qualms about stealing from others including those less fortunate than them.

No worries mate, I have much more than I need and I provide for myself and family with all the modern luxuries by working hard and making the right decisions.

You provide for your pathetic immoral selfish being by sponging off others. Just two different styles. You keep your lack of class, and I'll continue to be content with mine! Cheers!

P.S. I do not pay taxes which would apply to Obamacare. Nice try, though. Have fun stealing from others, not paying your own way, and never being fully financially independent.

I don't have to evolve, 1eekx. I'm enjoying the retirement I had planned and prepared for years. The Obamacare angle I'm taking advantage of (thanks to you and millions of taxpayers) was just a brilliant flute of luck that was an unexpected benefit to bridge the gap for me until I'm 65 in the next 3 years. Sure, it's only giving me a $14,640 annual savings over shoulding the entire load myself, but what the hell, I'll take what I can because I can.

@NYl0bIP-1eari, It's interesting how the one's on this site pretending to be all happy and content are also the same losers continuously crybabying and complaining like you. That's rich. Try something believable next time, and keep licking your wounds, pathetic parasite. Maybe one day you'll evolve into something useful.

Thank you, 1ekor. Water off a duck's back. Keep paying my way and stop complaining.

1dkkk, Yes indeed, thanks for pointing out the distinct difference between someone like you, a liberal democrat "Taker", and those who work for a living and support themselves and are happy to support others. That's because we are strong, conservative, successful, and the "Makers" - the builders of our great society, true Americans and you son, are a parasitic liberal socialist "Taker" by your own words. You said yourself that you are a bottom feeding thieving parasite and others pay your way and you are useless and contribute nothing. I appreciate your honesty. Most parasitic leech liberal mooches are not and pretend to be Americans.

Enjoy your futility and I am happy to support your useless incompetent A$$ as I do many others on welfare and foodstamps.

To each his own. Stay happy with your private insurance and I'll stay content with my ACA plan. The only difference is that you pay for yours and you also pay for mine. LMAO.

@NYl0bIP-1dxqz, I sure hope that it's him that has a stroke and not you if you are one of those on the exchange health insurance plans. If you have a stroke and you have the ACA only you will surely die before they get to you, if they even finish with the paperwork in time to get you admitted. At least that's the experience that I have had. Never again. Next year I'm getting real insurance. My life is worth much more than that. You and all you little adolescent beaver and buttheads and sarcastic imbecile hecklers on this site do what you want, it won't bother me any.

1dxqz , Who the hell are you replying too, the butthurt dude? i'm happy with my ACA subsidies. Speak for yourself, losers while you work to support my ACA subsidies! ROTFLMMFAO S---UHs!!!!!!!!!

LMAO @1dxqz and impotent 1dbik ha ha ha ha ha !

One thing for sure is the ROTFLMAO guy will soon have a stroke if he continues his silly rants here. Wise up, buddy. No one really cares much and there's nothing you and others with the same view can do to change what's going on. The ACA law, with all its weaknesses and built-in loopholes (purposefully designed or not) will continue and everyone, including our loathed "ACA leech", will take what is legally entitled to every American. Your b!tching and ranting, @ROTFLMAO, would be best served if you directed them to your Congressman instead of wasting your energy here on this site.

1dfwm: when I say small d--k I am looking right at you my boy and a ROTFLMAO right back at ya.

1dmli, Yes, I agree but don't understand your comment about accepting (assumed fraudulently) disability and being an impotent loser. That's pretty pathetic. Are you describing yourself?

1dpkj, Yes, he struck your raw nerve enough for you to respond to a troll, that's a certainty.

-1dchk: I typically find the loudest butthurt jackass in the room is the biggest sinner; full of self hate. Such a big self-inflated man on the anonymous site turns out to be milking undeserved disability payments and stealing beer money from momma's purse. ROTHLMAO rather than crying because I am such a impotent loser.

@1dchk - Must have struck a nerve LOL.

1dwlm, Yes, of course, sweet child. You weren't a parasitic sponge liberal democrat before you read my post, but "poof!" magically after reading it you are now going to nurse your mommie gubmint teat!!! I SO believe YOU!! You are so truthful and honorable and believable!!!!! You just needed a little tiny push to get you to agree with a "guaranteed minimum income"!!!!Ha ha Ha ha Ha !! Too funny! What a pathetic helpless little parasite leech tool!!! You need big boy gubmint to be your mommie and daddie!!!! You cannot support yourself!!! Ha ha ha ! "guaranteed minimum income"!!! Ha Ha HA HA I've never heard that one!!! Pathetic!!!! I wish for Free Money from Others that I did not work for, because I am helpless and desire to sit on my good-for-nothing lazy P.O.S. Keister!!!!! LMAO!!!

This is too much. I haven't been entertained this well since I've been reading these posts!! Please keep it up my little sponge creature!! You need a host to beg, mooch and leech from. I will help you my little pathetic sponge parasitic dependent infant!!! Please take a breadcrumb from me, loser LMAO!!!!