Thread regarding Qualcomm Inc. layoffs

Anonymous200079, well wrong again, you see I rented out my place in SD until I was sure of things, then sold it to capture the 2 out of the last 5 tax free and refinanced up here. So tripper dipper, SD appreciation, SV appreciation, renting in excess of cost basis down there to help bridge the loan. And here is the appreciation curve, http://www.zillow.com/sunnyvale-ca/home-values/. Pretty good curve, huh? mkay? Best part is that this brings in my retirement date to relocate back home with my family to Bangalore. So long suckers.

Anonymous199918.. You see, if you really did buy 4 years ago in Silicon Valley, it means you sold 4 years ago in San Diego.. And if you sold in San Diego in 2011, you sold at a REALLY BAD time. Because the percentage increase in home prices between 2011-2015 in San Diego is greater than the percentage increase from 2011-2015 in the bay area. The 2009 real estate crash took a much bigger hit in San Diego than it did in Silicon Valley, because nominally house prices were already pretty high due to the IPOs of companies like Facebook, LinkedIn,etc. You didn't get that much of a discount in Silicon Valley as a result of the subprime meltdown. Here in san diego, that wasn't the case. Home prices fell much more (percentage wise) between 2009-2011 in San Diego versus Silicon Valley. L.A. probably was even worse than San Diego.

Anonymous199918, Liar again. 4 years ago prices were already much higher than before. So again, you're full of shit.

Too late suckers, I already live in a great house in the bay area because I left QC 4+ years ago and moved my family up here, so we bought before the huge run up, so I've been able to enjoy quite good appreciation along the way. If the bay area isnt for you, and it sounds like its not, fine, suffer in SD. Im just here to say that bay area kicks SD butt and thats why we have people lined up to come work there.

Oh, and $1million in Silicon Valley will put you in a crackhouse in Milipitas, which again, is equivalent to Santee. So I'm not sure where you got the idea that you would be living in a house with "much more character", unless you think that a house with cheap wood panels from the 60ies-70ies have more character that "stucco boxes" in SD. And then of course, if you have kids, your kids would end up in a shitty school district there, instead of say a tier one school district in San Diego.

Anonymous199389. Oh, and I seriously doubt you put down $1million of our equity in your primary home in San Diego to buy a home in Silicon Valley and didn't even blink to do that. Because if you did that, there's one other aspect that would have been obvious that you would have brought up, but completely didn't. If you took your SD home that you bought for $400-500k and sold it for $1million, which I'm pretty sure you didn't. You would have had $500k-600k in capital gains.....$250k would have been exempted rom capital gains taxes (IRS rule for sale of primary home if you are single, or $500k if joint), leaving you with $250k-350k in capital gains that you would have had to pay 23% in taxes on (capital gains taxes is 15%, but it would have pushed you into a much hire tax bracket that year too, and your effective tax rate would have been 23% including CA state taxes, and that's on the low side). So reality is that you would have not $1million working cash, but closer to around mid-$900k. (Assuming you're house in SD was already paid off and had no mortgage). And on top of that, you just bumped up your property taxes significantly from 1% assessed property taxes on a $500k place in san diego up to 1% assessed property taxes on $1million crack house in Silicon Valley. Congrats, while you were mentioning about not having to pay for HOA in SD (which is roughly $200/month for a SFH or less), you are now going to pay $10,000 in property taxes instead of $5000 /year indefinitely, even long after you've been laidoff for whatever reasons in the future. And that's even assuming property taxes are only 1% in Silicon Valley, when clearly they are not with all the extra bond initiatives that were tacked on to your property bill. I hope you had considered that when negotiating your compensation package with that pre-ipo startup in the valley too.

Anonymous199389, That's horseshit. First, the reason why it might be appealing for you is you had a home with equity that you could cash out and use to buy a house in Silicon Valley. As such, you traded a slightly nicer crap box in san diego with a horseshit crack house in Silicon Valley, and don't need to deal with finding housing. You are an exception. Most people moving to silicon valley are not that lucky because they actually need to worry about money. Either they are starting out and don't have shit, or they are moving from out of state from a lower cost area. You dont need to worry about money for a house because you got lucky and won the stock option lottery at Qualcomm. As far as silicon valley hiring the "best talent". That's horseshit too. Unless you happen to work at Apple or Google or Facebook, most other companies just want bodies that are reasonably average competent who are willing to relocate there. Most places don't even require a rigorous full blown interview. I've gotten so many offers from startups up there with just 1 or 2 phone screens, and it always ends with (I make $$$ down here, how much are you going to pay me $$$$$ up there to get me to move? I'm not laidoff yet BTW, so I'm not desperate)...And the numbers NEVER work out to make it compelling. Now it's different if I am truly unemployable down here in SD because my skills stink or my skills are outdated, or if I specialized in something that is specific to QC such that no other employer will hire me. In that case, yes in all likilihood there is some company in the Bay Area that might want to hire me and might want to retrain me, simply because they need bodies to fill positions, irrespsecitve of abilities. But clearly, this isn't bringing the "most talented people" into the valley. It reminds me of Web 1.0 companies up there in which you would have "Senior Software Engineers" that couldn't even write 1 line of code. Many were HTML copy editors that were hired into Senior Software Engineers. It's a well known fact that Silicon Valley has want the industry knows as "title/position inflation".... If you think it's bad that Qualcomm has a bunch of Directors/VP titled people, just go the valley.. IF you aren't a "director" of something or at least a "manager" of something, you definitely moved for the wrong reason, because companies routinely hand those out too just to get people to move there. Sounds to me you bought in to the Silicon Valley cool aid. Like I said, let's see how you feel in about 1-2 years once the tech bubble deflates. The difference between you and me is that I've lived in both Silicon Valley and San Diego to know that the industry up there is completely cyclical, and no...This time it won't be any more different than it has been up there for the past 30 years. Silicon Valley is due for a correction. Just look at the pre-IPO market. The powder is dry. No major IPO scheduled from the Valley. With the exception of the large behemoth companies out there (Facebook, Google,Apple, LinkedIn), there isn't that much activity in terms of companies going public..the IPO activity has dried up. Writedowns are already happening for private companies like Snapchat for example. (Read here: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2015-11-11/snapchat-s-value-cut-by-25-in-fidelity-write-down) That wouldnt' happen if the IPO craze was in full swing. So you can bet the best days of this boom cycle in tech are near over. And don't give me that horseshit about companies doing things only for the love of engineering. Again, with the exception of Google, Apple, Facebook, most other companies that are startup only want to go public or to get acquired by Google/Apple/Facebook so that the people there can make a shitload of money off of pre-ipo shares. So again, if you're going to join a startup, you would be an idiot to not think about money, how much YOUR equity stake is in that startup, how much YOUR equity stake is immuned from share dilution in succesive rounds of funding if needed, and what YOUR exit strategy is ...Because it's pretty obvious that's what is occupying most of the startup owners/management team's mind everyday.

Anonymous199326 - I got news for you kiddo. I've done fine at QC, so I don't need to be fixated on money, apparently like you are. But what I want to do is new and interesting work, working with people who are similarly psyched to do a great job, learning from coworkers, and applying my efforts in a positive work environment, all aspects of which have been on decline in QC since the 2000's. If you examine my original post, it never said anything about going to the valley to hit it big. And this idea that others are moving to the valley to hit it big is also misguided. Certainly there are a good number here that are looking to do that, but by and large, most people are moving here because they are looking for good paying jobs, pretty simple. Your lack of empathy for that fact just belies you own motivations (money seeking). Anonymous199329 as much as your think you know about this area, and your admonishment to hire people who already live here, we are seeking the best talent, whether they are here already or not. And those that are not, are obviously interested in relocating, and there is no shortage of them. And this whole wages-haven't-kept-up is simply BS. Wages havent kept up anywhere in CA, SD included. People are making money in other ways and they are buying houses and this wages-not-keeping-up argument just doesn't hold water. At these prices, of course, no one can make a mortgage payment based on wages. People are often putting down 1M+ in equity that they have from previously owned homes and financing 400 to 600k, which is doable on SV wages.

OP of 198852 &199242: In 1983 when we bought our first house in Silicon Valley, Palo Alto was already overpriced. So we bought a house on the edge of Willow Glen for about $150,000. Same house today costs about $1.5 million. Needless to say, wages have not kept pace with inflation. If you are sorting through resumes from people from San Diego who want to live there, but are hoping to find people who won't be working just for the money, you're in for a major disappointment. If they don't already own a house and they want to buy one in Silicon Valley they will be "wage slaves." It will be Qualcomm all over again--only instead being chained to a mortgage on a million-dollar mini-mansions in Carmel Valley, it will be one of those smarmy stucco ranch-style homes in Cupertino or Campbell. Or maybe an Eichler in Sunnyvale. Only solution is to hire older engineers who already own property there, or who aren't interested in owning real estate in Silicon Valley.

Anonymous199242

That's bullshit. If pay really doesn't matter that.much to you, you would take a pay cut and join one of the many IOT startups in San Diego and still have a comparable living standard.to something in the bay area, for the love of engineering. But the fact is people go to the bay area for the money.and for the dream of hitting the big one. So don't tell me you are there for the engineering aspect.only. you wouldn't go if the pay was shit and or there wasn't a gold.rush fever there right now. Let's see how you feel in a year or.two when the tech bubble.deflates there.

Anonymous199085, this is OP of 198852. I have been trying to figure out how to respond to the posts following mine, but you hit the nail on the head with "The fact that everyone on the QC forum is fixated on salary and housing costs just shows people are only showing up to work for the money". While I did fine, this type of approach excludes all other factors that one should consider for a general area: other employment opportunities, neighborhoods, community, tech vibe and meet-up scene, and for an employer: retirement benefits, learning opportunities, quality of co workers, variety of work assignments, company vibe and energy... the list goes on an on, but for some reason these people are squarely focused on money. And I think you are right, I don't want to work with people like that, and they can just stay there, apparently it fits them well. But I believe that many people are looking for better. And this isn't' just a feeling, its something I know because I look at resumes and we are inundated with people from QC trying to move here. So its clear people want out and are looking for a better situation. So my posts are not directed to losers like Anonymous199069 and his ilk. Quite frankly. I'm embarrassed they were/are employed at QC and I wouldn't be surprised to learn that they were laid off or just trolling and never worked there. So to be clear, people will pay more for housing in the bay area. Thats no secret. But if you are intelligent, dedicated, and are looking to do better engineering work in more enlightened environment than is provided at Q, you'll do fine in the bay area.

852 you make an excellent point. Money aside the tech jobs in SD have always been very crappy considering this is a large affluent city. People put up with a lot of abuse and drudgery because outside of work this is a nice place to live. But you spend a lot of time in the office so it is important to enjoy the work you do. Many at Q seem extremely unhappy and to be honest I think this has more to do with SD just not being a good place to build a rewarding engineering career. We are basically the Mexico of California :( If you are happy with housekeeper or landscaper wages, respect, and job growth you will do fine here. But if you want career growth and longevity you are in the wrong city. The fact that everyone on the QC forum is fixated on salary and housing costs just shows people are only showing up to work for the money. They have no vested interest in the success of their employer and their motivation is all self centered. They do not enjoy working in the industry. People who show up to work on for money and usually have very unsatisfying careers and and ironically often ultimately financial pain, exactly what they feared most.. Find a company you like in a city you enjoy. Forget about Q and SD, The ship has sailed.

PO back here, I have a 3rd problem with Bay Area : 3) women to man ratio ("man jose")

It is full blown sausage fest. The ratio of men to women is pi cubed (3.14)^3. If you are not a white dude with lots of $$ to throw around and a nice house weekends will be spent surfing porn with a supersize box of kleenex from costco.

Sorry guys what's the joke with "man Jose"?

Anonymous198852.

Liar. Post your zip code. If you think SD is crap shack...most bay area homes would be considered ghetto crack houses. I know because I have one. For the same amount of money you spend on a home in SD you get about 3/5 if a house in the bay area. There is no character with the majority of the homes in the bay area because most of the ones that have no hoa or MR are old homes built in the 60ies or seventies made with just no stucco and flatpanel wood. Most of Santa Clara county is that. The only homes that would have character would be financially unobtainable for the majority of you because those homes are in areas like Palo alto, los altos hills, etc. That is unless you live way out of silicon valley, like in Marin county. Come on, milpitas is the epitome of crap. It literally is built on crap...landfill of what was once a garbage dumpsite. On hot days you can still smell the foul smell, not to mention the penitentry nearby. Miltpita is equal to Santee in San Diego with the exception that milpitas has that rotten smell when it gets hot and homes cost about $400k more.

Just admit it. You bought an expensive crack house in the bay area, which is fine for bay area standards , but a joke relative to everywhere else.

MAN JOSE LOL !

I can tell you my experience - my total comp took a big step up moving to the bay area. I bought a place in a good enough school district, don't have waste money on Mello Roos or useless HOAs, and live in a unique home with character and not a SoCal stucco crap shack that looks just like my neighbors on the left and right. My 401k matching is way in excess of QC's. We have free food and snacks at work. There is tons more stuff to see and do in bay area vs SD. But best, by far, is that I get to do much better work than I could ever do back at QC and going to work is now fun and rewarding instead of the drudgery that QC became (same crap, different chip).

My total comp in bay area was $205k. It was very hard and we left. Leave bay area to the chinks

Okay, having lived there for quite awhile, Palo Alto, Cupertino, etc. don't have a lock on the best schools. Sunnyvale, Saratoga, Campbell, and several schools in San Jose are good. You can always add enrichment courses in areas that interest your child. And I'll be honest; Paly High isn't all it's cracked up to be. They had a major drug problem there a few years back--which I'm sure still exists, plus a student population with may too many "entitlement issues." (Not to mention higher end cars than most entry level engineers can afford.) Best bang for your buck: find a decent apartment you can comfortably afford and that lets you save for a house. Enroll the urchins in parochial school. As for housing, unless there is a major correction, I would be leery of buying anything. The vast majority of houses built recently are pure crap, from a construction standpoint. For most families, it now takes 2 salaries to be able to afford something decent comfortably, and if one of you loses your job 3, 5, or 8 years down the road, you could wind up in foreclosure before you sell the place.

I didn't know @bitterlandlord HAD any "humble" opinions, but that's actually good info.

Anonymous198713. It's worse. At least in SD, you're 15 minutes to the beach. In Bay Area, you'll be 30-45 minutes out. That said, Tahoe is 3 hours away and there's great skiing there. And Laguna Seca isn't that far away if you're into motorsports. And there's always wine country. I miss the Bay Area. It's a great place to visit, and I go there to catch up with friends and family. But from day to day lifestyle (in which I value having free time and chilling), SD imho is still better. If you're young, with no family, and don't own any homes in SD, I would recommend you give it a try... though again, you're slightly late in the game...Seems like tech bubble is starting to deflate. You can probably get about 1-2 more years before things get bad up there, and then people will start moving back down to SoCal again...Folks unfamiliar with the dynamics of california is that usually what happens is you have a slowdown in SoCal, NorCal's tech industry ends up booming...Tech workers migrate up to NorCal (usually late in the game)...And then there's a bust cycle in NorCal while SoCal recovers, in which those transplants end up moving back to SoCal, which each body of movement during the cycle jacking up rent and home prices in those respective areas...And that cycle repeats...The exception is we're in sort of this interesting predicament that in addition to the general SoCal to NorCal and back to SoCal migration that usually goes on, we also have a lot of asians that are immigrating here in both NorCal and SoCal, driving up real estate demand (since they have money)...And on top of that, builders have been really slow in keeping up with demand, since the 2008/9 crash took the wind out of a lot of builders. And of course, in NorCal, there really isn't that many places where you can build houses anymore. My recommendation is that if you plan on staying in CA for a long time, try to get a house in both NorCal and SoCal during the pullback in each location.

is cupertino equally boring as suburban SD? At least there's a beach in Encinitas.

Speaking of which. Let's put this in perspective. Let's say you do earn a $200k/year salary up there (unlikely for you folks starting out and unlikely in a startup). After uncle same 42% of it will go to the Federal and CA State taxes (assuming you don't itemize and don't have a primary home mortgage to deduct,etc). That will leave you with a $116k/year. $4200/month for rent (assuming you have a family and need a SFH), will cost you $50400year in rent alone (none of which you can write off on your taxes), leaving you with $65000. Your kid will end up a in crappy public school (since it won't be in one of the better areas like Palo Alto or Mission San Jose or Cupertino where rent would be even more per month), so you'll end up spending another $16,000/year on a private school per kid+daycare since you won't ever see your kids. If you have 1 kid, that would be $49,000/year left. Your general living expenses (food, clothing, utilities,etc) will also be about 20% more, which for argument say lets just say is $5000/year more (on the low side), leaving you with $44,000 ...At $600/sqft for real estate (which is on the low side), a small SFH that is 1900sqft will cost you $1,020,000. You would need at least 20% down, which would be $204,000, which would take you about 5 years in strict savings just to come up with enough to prequalify for a loan. And then you would still need to deal with all the other people who are also trying to buy a home their who have been there longer. Is that worth it? Maybe. If you can score a $200k/job don't make more than $150k/here where you are now. If you aren't getting that and/or if you make more than $150k/year here, it's probably not worth it.

You have a third option. $4200/month for something 1650 sq ft. I have one available until the end of this week, where I'll decide among 5 applicants that really need housing, now that they have relocated from SoCal to Bay Area for Apple. Keep your pre-ipo stock options and keep dreaming of hitting that gold rush. I'll take your cash every month, since cash is king.

$730 sounds cheap. slumming it in Man Jose?

It's not St Andres' fault