Reservoir engineer, 12 years experience. Interviewed for a similar position and was told on Friday that I was successful. I would be coming from another major IOC. Main reason for wanting to leave current company is due to refusing to promote me to a senior level position, despite the progression being standard after ~10 years. Base salary would be a little under 10% higher at EM, but would be giving up 9/80 and hybrid work schedule (could be wrong but don’t see these benefits at EM). Only thing that gives me pause is the insane amount of LI posts about people leaving EM - is the company culture really that bad or are these your standard tech jumps? Any thoughts would be appreciated
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Last two posts look like Bitter Barb had a little too much whine with her turkey this year. Must be real fun at parties.
Replying to @1azu+1dVuEi0D
Your 1st point - yes, there is a bit more negativity these days. Has not always been that way. There is even an Exxon Cheer song that you can google to hear how excited and proud people use to be working for Exxon. Mobil folks were happy as well.
2nd & 6th point - good on you for negotiating a higher salary. But a caveat, your higher salary has put you in a higher CL and salary band. Good luck swimming with the EXPERIENCED EM sharks. You are new so you get handled with kid gloves your first couple of years. It is a known fact (in ranking they will even say THAT). The ranking seems like a cake walk to you now. But don't be blinded and so gullible. The thousands of people talking about the ranking system can't all be wrong. It comes from experience and you are new to the company. Look at all the people leaving...ranking plays a part in that. You are one day away from having a bad rank...a new supervisor, a supervisor who doesn't like you, back stabbing colleagues, good projects going to your colleagues, inheriting problems, age, favoritism ...so many factors and sometimes is out of your control. Something a few of us have heard ---boss says "sorry, I tried to get your ranking up during the rank sessions but it was out of my control" Be careful with your perspective about how it wasn't hard.
3rd point - 9/80s. Heritage Exxon folks prayed we would get the 9/80s that Mobil had but just before the merger we heard not on your life!
Have done your research. Lee Raymond and many managers would say in Company Town Halls - "why would I give you a day off for working 9 hrs when you are and should already be working that now". Also, your research may have uncovered that former Corporate VPs would say that they work Monday - Sat. Or, those that joked when they left at 5:30pm, they were taking a half day vacation. You know that ranking you said wasn't so bad? I don't see the youngsters these days putting in half the hours we use to... good for personal life but wonder what that means for the company. My boss is online on weekends and holidays. Take a peek and I bet you will see your boss, bosses boss and colleagues are online at all hours (sometimes you can't tell bc they are on their iPhone working). If not, you are lucky now...
4th point - I was shocked that we brought in an experienced executive from outside. That was a first. But the old culture is still there and if you haven't been "raised" in the culture, don't count on being an executive. I don't think the technical background is a hinderance so much as I think not running some part of Operations will be. Look at organizations like SSHE, the 2 senior guys ARE NOT SSHE and they did NOT come up in the SSHE org, they have had operations experience. Same for other orgs...gotta know the operations and frankly, I think this is important. You can be technical and run a BL... but you gotta do it early on...get out of EMRE and URC and into an Affiliate to get that experience.
5th point - flex time is all dependent on the boss.
Just want to add - when they learn what they can about what you did at your other company (particularly if you came from CVX), well when that newbie card is gone, you become like the rest of us...
If you are in your late thirties and haven't even had a FLS job yet... highly probable you are NOT going to be an executive. Gotta punch that Planning card too. Good luck to you.
OP - you say that ranking at current company is 85% middle with outliers on either end. That is entirely different than EM - even if you are the highest skilled and most productive in your work group - you can be put into the bottom barrel for any nonsensical reason. There is no such thing as “merit based” pay or ranking. Make an accidental charge on company credit card - Pip’d. Say something that upsets a young newbie supervisor - Pip’d. Want more hydrid/WFH options - Pip’d. The lust goes on and on. Someone upthread said that people are in here whining because they have previously been sheltered from layoffs. WRONG. Employees were blatantly lied to (false assurance of no layoffs) . To then be laid off. Ranking system was made o er to “seem” as more beneficial for people to Mo e up when in reality it was so they could drop quicker with no forewarning. 401k match was taken away and employees found out via a leak in the media - NOT from their own Management. Being dishonest to employees is a big red flag. Trust has been broken.
Don't buy, rent.
@2vsc+1dVuEi0D - I hope the new Sr. VP will survive as an experienced hire in the company...unless her job is only for M&A and chopping, then it makes sense why she was hired...it is easier for external person to implement the chopping than an internal person...
As an experienced hire myself here are my experience:
You will not be considered EM.
You will be treated like a contractor but won’t be laid off in the first wave.
Your rankings will always be at mid level or lower so raises and promotions will be low.
You will not move into management.
Your ideas based on your previous employment will be considered a threat and not achievable at EM.
Stay out of the swamp
Also an experienced hire from another major, here ✋
First point: Exxon people are much more negative about their situation than people at other majors who get here. They’ve been protected from layoffs that the rest of us have been constantly subjected to for a decade now. As a result, last years layoffs were a real gut punch to them.
You need more than +10% to make the move, go for +20% minimum. In my experience they will negotiate after the first offer. If they offered you exactly what you asked, make up some plausible excuse about total compensation and they may move up.
Losing your 9/80’s will bother you more than you’re expecting. I knew the deal going in, and it doesn’t hurt at first, but then when you get busy and it’s 5:30 on a Friday and you really have better things to do outside of work …
You’ll be fine as an experienced hire if you want to stay technical (other people have said this). But if you’re late thirties and still technical and you think you’re going to make it to VP, forget it. But that’s not an Exxon issue, that’s everywhere.
So far, ranking isn’t as cut throat as most people make it. I’m ranked higher here than at the other major. There’s horror stories, I’ve seen at least one. I think that depends on your bosses and bosses bosses.
Flex schedule depends on your boss. My group has no problem hybriding office and home now, nobody is making us punch in and out, just get your work done.
Clear cookies, revote
I am an experience hire.
1- you never going to be part of the club since you were not campus hire
2- flex work is BS at Exxon.
3- ranking is based on your network. Since you don’t work here long when time for ranking comes this will ALWAYS protect the employee that was hire out of school
I do have robotic and weirdo supervisors that talk funny.
Fellow experienced hire here. I've been promoted three times in ten years. Doubled my salary. Really depends on your workgroup. Mine is majority experienced hires. We all stick our necks out to challenge the status quo (XOM is behind in my business/technology). I don't regret changing companies for XOM. Past experience may not translate into whatever the F hunger games we seem to be heading into. But it is closer to the hyper competitive company that I left. XOM has been very cushy for a very long time...
I was warned by multiple folks before I joined one of the manufacturing sites. I was told similar to what is being said on this board and I thought to myself it cannot be that bad. No joke, it was that bad. I wish this board had private messages so I can message you directly because I do not want to go into too much detail on the public forum. I came in as an experienced hire and I was PIPd out of nowhere. Right after the holidays I was told all is well, then bo-m. I was told I am NSI but eligible for the MLRP program which is the fancy new name for being PIPd. Total shock. I battle with anxiety and this whole thing took me off the edge. I am not saying other companies don't lay off but please just lay me off instead and give me severance pay instead of this demeaning and shameful process.
But to answer your question, I would say join for the experience. Having XOM on my resume boosted my market value. I had the opportunity to interview and get offers from top consulting forms, tech, and rival oil companies and all within 3 months of getting PIPd. I eventually accepted a job with 25% more pay and the culture is humane. I do not have robotic and weirdo supervisors that talk funny.
I won't lie, after a few years I starting being a kool-aid drinker and would do whatever was necessary to make XOM happy, maybe that's why the PIP hurt so bad. It is just business though, I got paid for my contributions and when they did not need me anymore they tossed me and it is the same way we toss companies when we find better offers.
I wish you the best!
Avoid this place like the plague. Most experienced hires are treated like Sh!t and with ranking 50% are PIP’d within 3 years. Also why would you give up 9/80 for minimum of 10/100 without other work flex for less than 25% salary increase?
You will be treated like contractor sc-m and likely PiP'd out within 2 years. Also, your chances of landing a toxic dishonest supervisor are high
Run away! Last year, in July 2020, some of my colleagues were told to accept a 3 month Pip (performance improvement plan) and maybe get fired during that or get fired immediately with 3 months pay. This came out of nowhere. The general employee population. learned about this change to the performance system via a leaked document that showed how the system was changed vs. the previous year. For the first time, new hires from campus were subject to ranking and being labeled needs significant improvement (usually had a one year grace period) and didn’t even get a Pip option, they were just told to leave with 3 months pay. Supervisor looked their employees in the face and told them they weren’t performing adequately with little to no indication ahead of time, which was probably a lie in 90+% of these conversations. The company acknowledged the ranking system change months later (the months in between, higher up people acted like no big deal, people just fu----g disappearing from your team). They then dragged their feet on a layoff and told everyone that they would get 60 days notice but have to work those 60 days (can you imagine, coming to work, knowing your career is over there and you are just going through the motions). Oh and they didn’t make most people work the 60 days,just “critical people” but they didn’t want to hear the backlash about that selection process so like cowards, they just told everyone the same thing which was a big mindfuck leading up to layoff.
Let me be balanced here:
Pros: good people (peers), beautiful campus
Cons: ranking system, bad management (supervisors and 2nd level management can be good), toxic culture
I wouldn’t advise anyone to join the company, including friends and family. Really sad to say.
Welcome! Please add and contribute to our toxic work culture with your d-mb ideas
I highly suspect that you're coming from CVX based on your input so far. If that's the case, CVX is far better than XOM. I know a lot of emps and contractors at CVX and I have been here at XOM for more than 2 decades and based on what I have seen so far, CVX is better.
Your chances of being promoted are slim. Your are going to be competing fighting with a## kissers that have years of kissing up to the supervisors. If you are coming here for glory you will be disappointed. People are leaving exxon because they are stuck in there positions with no hope for advancement. Find a better company to work for.
Don't do it
10% salary increase is a good reason to leave but chances are that you will never get the higher position in EM that you are seeking right now. Yes, there are example of experience hires that have done well (but not stellar) in the US but this was during a growing period.
To be clear, the reason that they are hiring is that, due to resignations, the decrease in headcount in the US is 10-20% more that what it was planned. The plan was to get there in 2-3 years as these positions shift overseas. But for the time being work is not being done. So you are being hired in a 2-3 year gig to fill this ho-e.
You can succeed if you are willing to brown-nose for most of the time and can secure a spot in the clique
I would strongly recommend to stay at current company or find another one that is not ExxonMobil. Forced ranking system is rigged to systematically remove 8% to 10% annually, often new/experienced hires who haven't had enough time to brown nose with the right managers. LinkedIn is flooded for a reason. Toxic incompetent management promoting their toxic incompetent buddies
@OP the jumps you're seeing aren't just the standard tech jumps. The high level corporate strategy is to shift technical jobs to low cost locations, so you're seeing the fallout from that approach on LI. Funnily enough, from what I hear they're grossly undercompensating the technical folks in these lower cost countries so attrition is quite high there too.
Our ranking system has always been bad (and if you weren't already aware, your compensation will be tied to your rank to a large degree), but was recently made worse when they removed some previously existing limits on how far you can move up or down in any given cycle. This means you can move from a top bucket to PIP in one cycle (I've seen this happen first hand), so that's a risk to sustained employment going forward every year. In the new system there also seems to be less overall oversight in the process, so if you don't get along with your immediate line management that year, you're in trouble. Actual, objective job performance is certainly a factor in your ranking, but the most important influence is your management's perception of you and their relative standing among other managers since it's a horse trading exercise.
As a mid- career experienced hire you are probably getting pulled in to do a specific technical job. If your goal is to stay technical and focus on your niche specialization, then you might do ok in our system if you're fortunate to land on decent teams. As an outside hire, you probably won't ever be considered for any sort of management role if that's what you're after. That said the corporate culture is changing a lot right now, so who knows.
Main reason to jump to EM right now would be if your horizons look particularly bleak at your present job and the 10% pay bump seems worth it. I think the right mentality at this point is to think of any job at EM as a 3-5 year gig (unless you're already in a low cost country... And probably even then). Don't plan on retiring from here, and plan to start the search for your next job shortly after you hire on (if you do). Good luck!
You will for sure regretted. If you don’t get promoted in your current company, how would you think you will get promoted in EM? Instead, you will have high chance to be PIP since you are new…
This company is a shithole now! Please stay away!
OP -@OP+1dVuEi0D
I would advise that you have a look at the reviews on Glassdoor before you make your decision...At least you know what to expect should you decide to join the company...From my experience, the reviews given in Glassdoor is pretty much accurate (as it is anonymous)...The only problem is that EM leadership don't have time to read the comments posted there...
Also for the next couple of years and the last 2 years at XOM the bottom 8% gets the PIP so everyone is moving down in ranking so decrease in raises and greater chance of PIP. A clever way to reduce headcount without severance packages as we move work to Malaysia and India.
Forced ranking at XOM means that the workforce is "forced" into 5 equal buckets. Roughly 0-20% Rank Group (RG); 20-40%; 40-60%; 60-80%; 80-100%. Equal numbers in each group so someone is at the bottom no matter what. RG determines promotion timing and amount of raise. Your ranking is relative performance, which means who every brown noses the best wins.
I think you will struggle to find any compelling case to join Exxon.
I thought the unhappy people at EM might be just a few.
I now know it is everyone based on UW bids to hang out with managent.
They tanked at $10
Talk about jumping out of the kettle into the fire. Xom is a sh-t show. Should have stayed where you where.
OP here - can someone explain what “forced” ranking means? We have a ranking system at my company but something like 85% of staff fall into the middle category, with the outliers being brownnosers on the positive end and technically inept on the negative end. So it makes it very easy to coast if you are at least somewhat decent at your job. Sounds like it isn’t the same at EM
@fbb+1dVuEi0D
What did mama cook for breakfast?
OP @xcp+1dVuEi0D is just a troll who's living in parent's basement whining about what used to be. Get a life you pusilanimous piece of putrifying polymorphus slug
Think, do you truly expect to find an unbiased and accurate answer here on this site? It’s a gamble you are taking, just accept it. Weigh it out and own the decision you make.
Experienced hire will be treated as 2nd class citizen in the company....don't dream about getting a senior level position because there are still a lot of people in the company who is waiting to get promoted to senior level position....also please think if you know how forced ranking system look like...if you never experience it, you probably will shock the first time you are being evaluated...my advice : stay away if you can...we have seen many cases where experienced hires left after several years due to the toxic working culture in the company....
What you see on this website is 3 unhappy people who were allayed off 3 years ago and are now living in their aged parents spare room creating whining post after depressing post on this website to make it look like all XOM employees are whiners.
Just watch the number of thumbs down my response receives to confirm what I have wrote!