Thread regarding SAP layoffs

It’s a bit hard to do training when the people hearing departments like “Innovation Factory” are all cons and they have to outsource their own Leonardo Center showcases to SAP partners to setup the systems. If they do the training to other SAP departments, their mask will fall over within the first hour. In the meantime, they can hide behind their grand titles and insider networks

@ckhk Sounds like Accenture has a well structured personal development/training program in place, that is what we would expect for a well established tech company like SAP. Only the sales teams get all the training but that will only get them into the customer's doors; once they are in, they would not know what to do because they don't have any real product knowledge except for the script they have to remember - it's all smoke and mirrors. Some of these newbie product managers know so little about the products that it is embarrassing when they talk to real customers.

One problem with the training programs from Accenture - they did not include any training on Lean Management, Design Thinking and Diversity at the Workplace ... :(

@hyb --- TRUE

This is not always the case, I worked for various tech companies and most of them have excellent internal training programs (e.g. Business Objects before it was acquired by SAP).

I spent 11 years with Accenture and the amount of training we were receiving overshadows anything seen at SAP. The first year there I got 4 weeks of training and an extra week to two weeks every year after that. As you progress and get promoted you get extra training every promotion year to get you ready for the next level in terms of responsibilities - the training is top notch, well planned, organized, you get quite a bit of hands on experience on both tech and managerial side, case studies, simulated projects, instant feedback etc. The whole shabang is careful organized, from transportation to facilities, food, after hours activities, team building, etc. It builds you as a professional, manager/technologist, builds your network and frankly every single time it was just a great experience. Granted, sometimes when on a long term project I'd have hard time finding a week to peel off a client, but somehow it always worked..

Dont get me wrong, we go many things better than Accenture but training is not one of them.

According to my former manager (based in Germany), there is an education budget for each employee per year - around $1K. Not too many employees are aware of this "unofficial" policy so they don't ask for any education. Unethical managers are spending the money elsewhere or on individuals that they like.

This is one of the key reasons why there is no personal development in SAP because no one cares. If you want any kind of training, you have to find it yourself and do it on your own time. Try buying a technical reference book from SAP Press and claim it as an education expense. You have to pay full price and ask for approval from your manager. The situation is pretty sad and pathetic ...

@ Self educational on personal time, have you tried finding a job OUTSIDE of SAP with the "education" you've received via OpenSAP, etc??? I can tell you, it's pretty much useless. For example, all those SuccessFactors courses on OpenSAP are just touching on the surface with no hands-on system to try on. Do you seriously believe a partner or customer would hire you just because you completed the theory SFSF courses on OpenSAP???

You have to find the time (your own most likely) to stay current. The content is available across openSAP, SFSF, and jam sites.

In ten years I have never had a formal course but have completed over 100 SFSF and openSAP courses on my personal time (00s of hours).

SAP customers pay a much higher rate for SAP than SIs. Only with this extra unpaid invest can I expect to have the skills to meet my utilization targets.

Good luck to you!

SAP has certifications but unlike many companies, it doesn't offer free exams to its employees.

Actually my manager told me that SAP doesn't like its employees to be certified, because that will make it easier for them to leave for a partner and get paid higher.

The same mindset can be the explaination why you don't see much comments in the code, or decent documents about technical details. When it is hard to learn and understand, it is more sticky.

Vendor lock -in and employer lock-in, very smart!

This is not always the case, I worked for various tech companies and most of them have excellent internal training programs (e.g. Business Objects before it was acquired by SAP). The employees are encouraged to participate in customer facing training sessions to learn about the challenges that real customers have to deal with and how the products work from a customer's perspective. This is a proven concept so the highly paid education folks from SAP should know.

How do you expect your employees to work with customers when they don't have solid knowledge about the products they work with? Everyone is supposed to promote HANA and Cloud but there is no training available. Just ask some of the young product managers from SAP, they cannot handle too many questions about the products they are supposed to manage and support - it is quite embarrassing at times. I don't expect this situation will change in their near future because SAP still has many incompetent education teams.

It's not only SAP, all big companies are doing this. There are very few formal trainings available to others in the technology field. Most companies expect tech employees to search it on the web or ask other people they work with. People that do get the rare training are few and far between and are expected to come back and train everyone else, which never works.

I'm a SAP customer, and also see this as a huge issue.