I am posting this question as a separate thread as I hv already posted it as a reply in other thread. But why there is age bias? I am worried because one day I am going to be 40 then I will be in the same boat. Is that because as soon as you turn 40 your brain goes numb, stops recognizing world around you? or 40+ people are too expensive? or physically unfit?
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Cisco practices this :
At interviews, they pose questions to fail you - if you are 40 or above.
Cisco will die down very fast. I am pretty sure about that.
Any Company doing this systematically, will not have a good name.
So will also Google which has practised that kind of Age Bias against Senior Employees.
It is high time to call these 2 CHEATING Companies and their Executives to be Cheats who should be painted black and shining for every one to be aware of.
40+'s cannot / will not work 14 hours a day, 7 days a week.
Plus they have the ability to see through corporate BS, and will roll their eyes and say "yeah, right' when their boss excitedly announces the next project as the greatest invention mankind has seen.
The 20+/30+'s on the other hand will fall for this and slog their asses off, thereby ensuring a promotion for their director, and a Connected Recognition award for themselves.
If you look at the headcount in Jan vs April, there is a diff of ~2500 that means Jan/Feb'16 LR reduced the head count by 2500 which is unannounced. I have heard that few teams have been let go in last week of July and 1st wk of Aug + all the contractors + indirect layoffs from cancelled positions + latest count of 5500, it will add up to 10K easy.
This is the 2nd layoff this year and is only the beginning IMHO. There was one in Jan/Feb that wasn't well publicized. The target is anyone over 35 and Sr. to Director level since the logic is that younger kids are needed and can be had for 1/2 the price. Performance wasn't a factor because top sales, management and marketing people were randomly hit.
Not a fun or safe place to work any longer. It's just a matter of time before your number is up.
Being under 40 can also be risky because they have to include a certain number of people under 40 to avoid age discrimination issues. I was the only person on my team that was under 40 and was one of the top performers on my team (confirmed by my manager), but when they are looking for the numbers they just grab and when those most times in San jose are making the decisions don't know you from a can of paint there's nothing your manager can do. Everyone always talked about visibility, but unless you were in San Jose or RTP it was really hard. They have now gotten rid of most of the Scientific Atlanta people so now the "classic" people will have to be concerned if layoffs come around again. The layoffs this week got rid of most of the remaining people brought on by acquisition and the sad part is Chuck Robbins stabbed the people who came over with him in the back. This was the first layoff that took place within 24 hours of notifying employees. Things have definitely changed at Cisco.
Idiots, you have a job because of the innovation the 40+ crowd did the last 40 years
To the 40+ and white people, I am brown and I am a millennium. I know that I was very fortunate to get the job as an intern and eventually as a college hire. I learned a lot from the oldies , i had the advantage of learning and trying out new technology while the more experienced people in the team working very hard covering for the whole team and keeping the business running as nornal. It's my white manager who put out training plan and ensured that the people of my color teaching me well. So to the white and oldies, i am very grateful and i am not a spoiled brat that some of you generalize here. My parents are going thru the same sh--hat you are facing now. It is a corp America issue, dont take it out on us! We are your children, grand children....
@ so called pampered millennials or whatever, don't forget your job is in the Management's hand that is mostly above 50. And one day you would be 40 too and some Gen Z will be laughing at you calling you old fart. So it's just a matter of time ..
@1oro, I hope you were LR because you don't represent the new Cisco. Go to your next HR wasted role or learn some real job skills.
If you over 40, you are lost cause and cannot innovate. Time to move on and let the next gen take over. Stop complaining about wisdom, experience, families, etc because we don't card and that makes you weak and a liability to Cisco. You can go work for governments or Home Depot or food services industry.
Don't turn this discussion into Millenniums vs 40+'s, or even whites vs browns (or whatever colors). We are all professionals and should treat people with respect, like we want to be treated. This post is about sharing information, advice, and experience. It's bad enough for 5500 families being affected with this LR, don't make it worse.
A note for the comment from a so-called Millenniums, the 20's will eventually turn into 40's 50's, everyone's time will come....
You have much to learn. Unless you "blow your mind" with drugs, your brain does not turn to mush. In fact many people in their 40s, 50s, 60s are as productive in their jobs, and maybe even more so -- and definitely more committed and reliable -- as those in their 20s. Take it from me -- I'm an HR manager. The reason why those in the 40'ish range or approaching it are targeted is because the insurance costs are higher -- families, tier levels. Even more importantly, companies do not want to get stuck paying retirement benefits and want them out before they accrue too much.
Age discrimination definitely exists and the bigger companies make sure they have their numbers in order so that it doesn't appear that there are more people in their 40s or older than those in their 20s, 30s. .
it's not money.
it's resentment.
younger guys in management positions resent and fear you,
because they usually scammed their way into their position.
Bottom line company want to save money , paying younger cheaper while still keeping old engineers that kind of good deals for company , they know situation in job market that many younger engineer looking jobs With better benefit
The cost to the company as you get older goes up with the instance coverage portion costing a lot more and then add the cost of dependent a on the insurance. Wonder if we had public insurance not insurance paid by employers if this would make a difference
As an over 40 worker who was laid off, my advice to you would be to either go into management or hone a skill that few people have. Be excellent at what you do. As you become more expensive to the company, you must become more valuable to compensate for that. This is hard to do.
Seriously...you think 40 is old? 😫
Regards question as to why cisco discrimiate to people over 40, it's simple. As you age over 40, the time speeds up but you slow down. it's natural process. company do not want to pay big salery for slowing work when time shrinks.
You need both young and old. That's kind of how it works. If young were the solution, you'd have the C-suite packed with them. There is a ton of things that only experience can help with. Yet, if you are young you simply have more stamina to go through gruesome deadlines, etc.
There are many other things that come into play, I really think that a healthy company will be well balanced.
Google is getting older, and they are still fine... FB will be older in a few years as attrition is low. So, it's a natural process.
Also, older guys tend to be more loyal and less 'jumpy' - if you are building a team that you want to stick around, it's so much easier to work with older folks.
What's not cool is when you target older folks due to age only - there is a story behind every person.
This is not bias. Let's call it discrimination. Junior workers are cheaper but they are amateurs. Good luck f---ing Cisco!
90% of people impacted in my group are 40+, 80% are 50+. So 50+ group hurts the most. And many of these people are not dead wood. They have recognition left and right... Just not having big enough political cloud!
Rqz: way too logical and clear. I prefer sarcasm and humor to these "geniuses of the future".
Now back to my PL/1 program.
Really? You don't understand? It comes down to money. People in their 40s typically have families. Families increase healthcare costs. A lot. And those children will need to go to college at some point. Or if they're young, day care. Kids need to get picked up from school by 3pm. Or earlier if they get sick. And they definitely can't travel at the last minute, especially because, in the Bay Area, both parents are probably working.
People in their 40s typically have a lot of valuable work experience, which also costs more in salary. People in their 40s have realistic expectations of their worth, which means they will negotiate for what they are worth.
From Cisco's perspective, MAYBE they're thinking as well that people in their 40s have tapped out their ability to learn new things, that you can't teach an old dog new tricks. If that's the way they think they obviously have never heard of Colonel Sanders, Grandma Moses, Julia Child, Vera Wang, or a whole host of famous people who didn't start what they got famous for until they were over 40.
And because most of Cisco's execs are objectively intelligent, they probably know that people over 40 can in fact learn new things. Which means, by process of elimination, it's an "economic decision."
You realize it's not about 9 to 5s and start speaking about what really needs to get fixed. Dumb and young will do anything for a little attention.
Bbbublooub. Whoops, that's my numb brain.
Back to my Fortran programming.
I hear that the new policy is to hire only those who were born after the 1990 and promote new managers who are younger than 35.
it's proven that 40 year olds run slower than less year olds.
in my package out of 86 canceled roles posted only 21 were below 40.....no comments
yeah - it seems that this is wide spread #AgeDiscrimination