Thread regarding SAP layoffs

Punit Renjen - what we know and don't know about him.....

I am the person who posted the youtube link the other day on Punit Renjen's ET interview and also posted some feedback from my team's private call we had yesterday. On some more reflection. I began to think about what we know and don't know about Punit Renjen.

We know from his ET interview that he considers an achievement while at Deloitte he oversaw the transfer of 100K jobs to India ( ~ 25% of total HC). We also know that he already has provided guidance to CK that SAP's current footprint in India is no where near high enough and has directed CK to increase this number. We know that his vision is that this is now India's century.

The role of any Chairman is to ensure that the expectations of the shareholders are met - basically they want good returns on their investments and the CEO runs the day to day biz. Simply put, there are fundamentally only 2 ways to increase the bottom line of a corporation and keep the shareholders happy, either you grow the company and increase revenues and presumably increase profit or you cut expenses.

Leaders who have the skills, knowledge and are capable of growing the company while at the same time increasing profits is an extremely small group of individuals. These best in class leaders must be people at the highest levels of understanding (i) all of the facets of the industry and business they will lead, (ii) where the future business opportunities are and how to be market leaders in these areas and which areas need to be left behind, and (iii) how to motivate of all the employees in one unified direction.

On the other hand, individuals who want to increase the bottom line by cutting expenses are a dime a dozen. This approach takes no skill whatsoever and the people who run on this basis are short timers and leave or get thrown out once the catastrophe is big enough - Elliott Group was one of these.

So does Punit Renjen fulfill the best in class description? Well he has no background in a leading a SW or Cloud company. He has not been involved at all in the Tech industry is not knowledgeable in our technology or our product portfolio. Rather, he is coming to us after 40 years from an accounting company which does tax returns, accountancy & audits. and some consulting such as how other companies should restructure. What stands out is his signature calling card in leading a massive job transfer from high cost to low cost country and he evidently knows India very well.

Our largest shareholders had the biggest say in who would become the next Chairman of SAP. I do not now think this decision was based on growing SAP, but rather on a new direction which involves restructuring aimed at reducing costs.

Friends, If you are in high cost areas like Western European countries, US or Canada, now would be a good time to ring the 5 alarm fire bell. This all about undertaking a massive displacement of SAP jobs. We haven't heard from Renjen because he doesn't want to disclose the reason why somebody who has no experience in our industry but plenty of experience in offshoring jobs was selected by our shareholders to become the next Chairman of SAP. Let us not be fooled by what was announced yesterday regarding this :"restructuring" of 8k positions - this is only the first tranche. None of us knows exactly how many in total will be shifted, but if past experience is any guide, we are looking at tens of thousands of jobs which will be departing high cost locations

And when this is all done in a year or two, Punit Renjen will likely be moving on and so will those who have been displaced - but the latter group will be moving in an undesired and different direction.

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| 4673 views | | 17 replies (last February 13, 2024) | Reply
Post ID: @OP+1qKuRmSY

17 replies (most recent on top)

Anybody has a full version of this article published on a German daily:

https://www.handelsblatt.com/technik/it-internet/softwarekonzern-designierterplattner-nachfolger-punit-renjen-verlaesst-sap/100014425.html

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Post ID: @jujg+1qKuRmSY

Nobody would know the real reason: maybe this site has a role to play haha!

“ SAP and Dr. h.c. Punit Renjen have mutually agreed to part ways because of a difference in perspective on the role of SAP Supervisory Board chair, which Punit was designated to assume. Punit has chosen to resign his mandate on the Supervisory Board with effect from the end of SAP’s Annual General Meeting on May 15, 2024.”

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Post ID: @haip+1qKuRmSY

Pekka Ala-Pietilä Proposed by SAP Supervisory Board as Designated Successor to Chairman Hasso Plattner

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Post ID: @htgy+1qKuRmSY

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/pekka-ala-pietila-proposed-by-sap-supervisory-board-as-designated-successor-to-chairman-hasso-plattner-302059132.html

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Post ID: @hoig+1qKuRmSY

The plan to replace high cost regional employees with India employees shared with T5 managers in December 2022, before Punit was officially announced. I think SAP Brain Trust was already thinking about how to drastically cut costs and then it became a perfect marriage with Punit. As some of you may know, S/4Hana Cloud Private Edition is the same code base as the on-premise ERP. Only in mid-2023 did SAP start to separate the code base. Point is, profit margin shrank a lot with S/4Hana Cloud PE vs. OnPrem version so they desperately need to cut costs. Truth be told, there are a lot of employees who are "Revenue Enablers" and not "Revenue Generators", so the out of touch Brain Trusts believe they can replace the Enablers with India. The hardest hit will be the Managers who have to manage an unproven India team with some struggling with English. I worked at Ernst & Young for 8 years before coming to SAP and I can see how Punit achieved success at Deloitte.

I think he will FAIL at SAP because Deloitte was a partnership and SAP is not, which will impact his ability to be effective. Product and Technology is worlds apart from consultancy. Remember, Hasso built the code. Punit is not an innovator, a creator, a technologist and no one on the Executive Board is either (except maybe for Juergen). Punit will fail.

Lastly, something doesn't add up with the Q4 Earnings Report Topline Revenue was up, but Cloud Revenue missed target and OnPrem revenue decreased faster than projected. So how did Q4 topline beat? My only guess is they charged customers more money for maintenance and services. In other words, revenue growth did not come from Cloud Products. Thoughts?

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Post ID: @2itu+1qKuRmSY

Somebody coming from Deloitte or any other of these consulting companies has absolute nothing to offer to SAP. Here's why:

We have had McKinsey, Deloitte and all the others come in to run some type of project the purpose of which was to make some type of organizational or work process changes - serious stuff. Every single time the "consultants" who have come into SAP to impart their wisdom have been entirely a group of College Graduates who just got out of school in the last 2 or 3 years and know absolutely nothing about SAP ( or the business world for that matter) and ironically it is these individuals who throw on a consulting hat that then gives them the genius to tell us how we should revamp our business.

But if you are looking for PPT's, well then, they have got plenty to spread around.... they just take the last 10 clients they worked for and change the names on the slides and then pass them around for their duration.

The only thing I am expecting once SAP is run by people from companies like this, is smoke and mirrors.

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Post ID: @1glk+1qKuRmSY

Regarding timeline, Renjen's Board appointment is for 4 years, ending in 2028.

Accordingly, his commitment to the shareholders to complete his "lift and shift" program would have had to be well before the the end of his term.

I would estimate that he will complete all of the offshoring within 3 years and if past experience is any guide, the number he provided to the shareholders is probably 20 -25% of SAP workforce will be based in India upon conclusion.

Most likely we shall see Deloitte in here within 6 months as it will be them who drive the "who and when" in terms of which jobs will be shifted to India. I also believe the shareholders will not be pleased with what the final costs of this offshoring ( including consultant fees) will be. But once implemented there will be no going back, SAP will be changed forever.

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Post ID: @1cwy+1qKuRmSY

With respect to how this alleged 8k employee restructure will unfold,   a couple of points come to mind

  • First none of us will have any clue if the total number of impacted employees in this so called "restructure" will be  5K, 8K or 10K, or some other number.    The fact is that we will all be in the dark as to how many are in this first wave of reductions.  We also know that  all "trust" has been completely and fully broken by this leadership team and t none of us will evermore believe a word which comes from them
  • Second, there is no, and will be no, process  in place which  identifies which employees would be considered for so called "reskilling" . This statement 's only purpose was to soften the blow of the impending layoffs  and give false hopes that somehow  some peoples career can be salvaged.   Maybe someday soon  CK  will be asked to spell out exactly what does "re skill" mean?? Do we take someone in one board area and shift them entirely to some function for which they have absolute no background?  Dont  think so. This statement was all BS.
  • Third, our colleagues in those countries  who are fortunate enough  to  have a Workers Council will have a significant buffer against any layoffs.  Most that SAP can do here is attempt to dislodge jobs with a VERP and then attempt to restrict any new hiring in these locations.  However this will take years to bring down the HC in these countries.  This all means that for high cost countries that do not have union representation they will take the full brunt of Renjen's  offshoring plan.  So basically comes down that if you are based in US or Canada, you are greatly at risk.

We don't know what Renjen presented to the Shareholders in terms of timeline to accomplish this plan, but clear that he has not allocated to much cushion as already the first group of 8k is being  identified and he is not even yet the Chairman.   I suspect that things will accelerate at a lighting pace and would not be surprised that Renjen onboards, his team from Deloitte who pulled off the massive job transfer over there.

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Post ID: @1wsu+1qKuRmSY

Clear to me that Punit Renjen visited with the major shareholders in advance of last years annual shareholder meeting and sold his offshoring plan to them. Coming from an accounting company he and his team were quick to see where SAP HC's are based today, what the salaries of employees in these high cost countries averaged out to be and based on this what the savings could be by moving tens of thousands of jobs to low cost country.

Plus to provide more credibility to the shareholders on such a complex and aggressive plan to move this many jobs and that he could pull it off, he pointed to the 100,000 jobs at Deloitte which he moved to India which he says went successfully. The shareholders bought his plan and we heard that he has already launched it by informing that CK is already at work on increasing HC in India. He is wasting no time towards implementing what he was hired to do.

Punit Renjen is not here because he has any experience running a SW or Cloud or even a technology company, this much is crystal clear. Therefore do not expect that he mandate is to "grow" the company into this space. He is here because he has experience in relocating and displacing not just tens of thousands of jobs on a random basis but rather moving entire organizations.

If you are a shareholder, this might very well be good news for you. If however you are an existing customer who bought an expansive ERP platform which now runs all parts of your business or if you are an employee, this will spell the end of the SAP you have come to know.

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Post ID: @1cad+1qKuRmSY

Agree with GL, there are certain hard facts which we cannot ignore. SAP is profitable today but if we compare it with its US based global peers who were founded 20-30 years after SAP, SAP are losing ground fast.

A quick comparison on numbers:

  1. SAP - 204B, founded 1972
  2. Oracle - 316B, founded 1977
  3. Salesforce - 270B, founded 1999
  4. Workday - 76B, founded 2005
  5. Service Now - 157B, founded 2004
  6. Microsoft - 3T, founded 1975

Just blaming one country and its people for all the upcoming SAP's problems regarding job transfers 'lift and shift' is short sighted and hateful which will only sow seeds of hatred and make the folks bitter.

Companies only care about shareholder profits and its survival. Nicely summarised here - https://www.thelayoff.com/post/@1ala+1qJv30pI and https://www.thelayoff.com/post/@zsi+1qCZaiZd

EU/ DE has to look within itself why there is not even a single local 500B company in the whole continent let alone a software company. https://companiesmarketcap.com/european-union/largest-companies-in-the-eu-by-market-cap/

With Punit Renjen taking over the chairmanship from May, I would have appreciated if he could have attended at-least 1 all hands and properly introduced himself and his priorities for SAP. I have a friend working in Deloitte US since last 12+ years and I second what Post ID: @cxt+1qKuRmSY has mentioned in this thread above: (https://www.thelayoff.com/post/@cxt+1qKuRmSY)

The competition is tough and on top of that EU/US is directly/ indirectly involved in wars and going through recession, inflation and high interest rates. Companies are decreasing their spending including SAP's and its peers' customers. The most common solution to be profitable in such times is to reduce expenses without affecting the operations. Lift and shift approach to less expensive job markets is one of the first things management could think of. That is why most of the US & EU companies shifted their manufacturing and production bases to China in 1990s after they were added to WTO. I am not supporting it because lives are affected but sharing my opinion only.

I would not be surprised if by the end of this year or next year (the geo-politicial & geo-economic) situation deteriorates and we have a recession then we are going to see major M&A (Mergers & Acquisitions).

Punit has good experience in M&A. Don't be surprised in that case if SAP merges with a competitor or acquire a smaller competitor. That is why a good market cap is very important which will help in raising funds from the market to support the M&A activity. Maybe that could be the reason why most of the decisions that were taken by CK, Asam and in the background Renjen were focused on making SAP lean, reducing operational costs including labour costs, ja--ing up the share price and market valuation and to go for the next level transformation. Most of you have already seen the hints in the charts presented by Asam in the all hands meeting. IMHO he holds more power and control over the major decisions now as compared to CK.

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Post ID: @1ecu+1qKuRmSY

I have been around for few years as well. I'd say, 18+ years is a long time to develop a sense of "inner workings" of the company.

While I understand the concerns, uncertainty of change in culture and urge to find "an overwhelming reason to believe , why those changes are happening", but as sensational as it may sound, Ranjan factor is overplayed here by a factor of 10.

I'm not sure, what la-la-land we are living. Fact is : it's the weird governance model of european headquartered companies which have kept SAP not so competitive. We didn't arrive here because Ranjan showed up few weeks back. Do yourself a favor and draw a chart of share of $CRM, $ORCL, $WDAY and $SAP. Forget creating shareholder value, our slowness is visible in slow pace of innovation is impacting our customer base !
Look on further , and look the european industry , and compare it with the US

No one would bother to talk here that SAP has underperformed the entire tech scene for last 10+ years massively !! While european entities have an obligation towards employees, but unfortunately, in the arena that SAP compete, there isn't just any time / space to breathe. This put SAP already at a disadvantage.

While i may not be here anymore when dust settles after Q2, but the fact is , SAP could become SAP of today, when henning kagermann decided to go global , otherwise it was just a 30-40B company in a village middle of nowhere ..

It's the US market and cost-effective locations, that gave it the leverage to do that. It's easy to get su-ked into your own "malise train" , but perhaps, developing a second order thinking and analytical reasoning is needed .

But then, perhaps, this is great reflection on the pool of people we have !

GL

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Post ID: @1trz+1qKuRmSY

I’ll remind you that under Vishal, you had an Indian mafia running around SAP.

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Post ID: @1pdl+1qKuRmSY

It's not just about moving jobs to India, I also expect more and more Indians to be promoted in US and Europe to managerial positions, whom will hire more Indians in return. It will have terrible consequences on medium term, and is a big red flag not just to employees but also to investors.

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Post ID: @wpi+1qKuRmSY

I am the author of the post and my position at SAP for the last 20 years has been to work with our consulting partners, including Deloitte as well as McKinsey, EY, PWC, KPMG, etc... I know these companies and many of their people on a global base very well.

However to be frank, some of the worst guidance SAP has implemented has come from these outside consulting companies.

LIke many at SAP we have all been involved in projects where we retained one or more of these outside consulting companies who then send in a group of consultants who have no practical experience in our business and go on to promulgate advice on how we should be structured/restructured or implement our next "transformation" project ( which is the most overused buzzword in consulting houses).... I would be hardput to think of one project where the advice provided by one of these consulting companies
really made a difference in our business. They were mostly a colossal waste of time and money and we would have been better off ( financially and output wise) running these projects organically.

I have no knowledge on exactly what Punit Renjen's responsibilites were - his Linked in profile seems to focus mostly on M&A support -that's as much as I know.

The point I was making is that he is not coming to us with significant background in running a fortune 100 SW/Cloud company - but rather it is clear that he does have a enormous background in offshoring tens and tens of thousands of jobs. I am not at all impressed in having a consulting background - and the major shareholders did not select him based on his Consulting background or SW/Cloud familiarity.

Why he was selected should now be obvious to everyone.

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Post ID: @wyu+1qKuRmSY

On Punit Rengen's background... your assessment is incorrect related to where he came from. I was at Deloitte during his tenure. He did not come through the Tax and Audit side of Deloitte. Punit came up through Strategy & Operations of the Deloitte Consulting business where he spent his career deeply entrenched in many technology companies. He has seen the inner workings of almost all of SAP competitors and is a deep expert in the space. Yes, he has expertise in and a track record of moving support functions to India. He has had great success in that.

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Post ID: @cxt+1qKuRmSY

No one cares.

They want to know what will happen with their jobs.

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Post ID: @coh+1qKuRmSY
  1. More jobs will move to India
  2. SAP will become more like IBM (no 401k matching for you)
  3. More SAP customers will leave as service level drops
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Post ID: @gtf+1qKuRmSY

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