Layoff all first line managers. No excuses of what and who needed anymore. We don't need this management
33 replies (most recent on top)
@bw project managers should be number 1 on the list. One per product and not a team of 10
There are many types of FLM at Intel. And some very good managers. Many are bad that's true. The system doesn't reward good managers who respect and trust engineers to do the right thing (which, if somebody only got an idea of what engineers at Intel do from comments on this site, should be no respect and no trust because I think most engineers posting here are d-mber than a rock), but those who are simply project managers and track nonsense in random spreadsheets. Those are the FLM that second level managers love because they cant challenge them. Managers manage, that's also a mantra in this place that is destroying the company. Managers must manage and be technical; they don't need to understand every line of code, or every detail in a design, etc, but they must understand the goal, the direction. And many can't do that. But if they did, because that takes time, they would be missing their real goal: track everything in a spreadsheet.
In any case, all of you saying that all FLM should be fired: you all should be fired. The company would significantly improve as a result.
@bq you are right. They can't even do that
First line managers aren't the Powerpoint Pros pushing lies up to the C-Suite.
FLMs are close enough to the work to understand. It’s the other layers upon layers of Directors, SR Directors, VPs, SR VPs, PEs, Fellows, etc who have no idea what’s going on.
All non-Def Met first line managers are fair game.
If they ask their line VPs who ask their line management who to layoff they will pick the people who make them look bad so the technical folks. We will end up in the same exact situation 5 months from now
The is a huge problem with first line management. They are probably the most surreptitious. And at Intel you’ve got to be exceedingly serpentine to hold that crown.
Like they say
If you don’t rate
Overcompensate
Signed The Offspring of a bloated culture
How's about cutting some of the floor techs that are on break 3-5 hours/day?
Posts like this just screams that Intel needs to trim the fat at all levels. The reality is that if they cut 50% of FLM, they should also cut about 25%-33% of line staff. They should have enough keystroke data to find out who is not on their computer at least 50% of the time actually typing words (not a mouse jiggler, not a program to type random words in Excel, etc) and in on a Teams meeting. Those who do not meet their thresholds should be invited to leave unless they have file at least one patent within the last 18 months.
Just don’t touch def met team
I do agree that the top managers will NOW have direct reports. First line managers will be cut for certain.
@as we have people in our team who do Grade 5 work and are G9 and G10. But hey, manager seems okay with it. Only means a few handful do 80% of the entire teams workload
Guys they make completely useless people grade 7’s when they do almost zero technical work and have an extremely light workload compared to the technical people. It’s a-s backwards!
Just an idea
Have everyone rate their 1st, 2nd , 3rd level managers
See how that reveals where each level below see the value of ‘leadership’ in their performance
Let each 1st level manager rate their own team
Somewhere in between reveals the real story of leadership and productivity
I don’t car if it an engineering org or other
Finance
Payroll
Hr
Legal
Sales
Marketing
Communications
IT
Chip design
Chip manufacturing
Supply chain
@an you took thr non technical job which we don't need in an engineering company. You can either become an engineer or leave. I don't know what you do besides 1:1 or team meetings. Not taking credit for someone else's work is the basics of humanity. Don't think it was in your job description for a reason
Problem is NOT with the first line managers It is with most managers managing other managers (sound even stupid in writing!)
To be honest I am tired. I build teams. Advocate for my people. Give them promotions and visibility and never take credit for their work. I have been an engineer who did such a great job engineering, they made me a manager. In fact, I am the kind of person you think should be managing... But what happens when you step out of a technical role to be the best at your new thing?
You know how many managers believe taking credit for their people's work makes them look better? When all the FLM are gone, now you can have new engineers promoted and have even more work to do. Honestly, I don't know that I want to manage in the new regime. I have never respected cube police and I don't believe in it. It's a distraction from our mission. My people are professionals. I don't want to be referencing an "in office" TPS report and having that talk with people. It sounds dreadful. We used to make fun of the "butts in seats" leaders.
This site is so bad. So many petty unprofessional comments. How did you get hired with such small thinking and living in a world of absolutes. You probably got laid off in SET, and deserved it.
I’m not terribly impressed with my FLM and wouldn’t mind if LBT assigned me a fresh choice but to hear you guys he must be in the top half of the pack and that’s sad
@aj yes cut till you have technical expertise. Too much flaky people surviving. If you don't do it now you will never
So ... the second line manager will now become the first line manager? Then what? ...
@ag shield how ? The first sign and they'll throw you under the bus. People are selfish and don't care about anyone. If there is a choice they will let a technical employee who knows more go and keep a non technical like them stay. Then complain they don't have a team to do anything. Seen this 1 too many times
We should hold tighly on to all FLM’s that are doing a good job. You know you have a good one if you have been shielded from the crushing depression of current developments. Also technical people should be managed by technical managers.
@ae what does that mean ? Management at Intel is a joke. All about survival, nepotism, DEI, long timers, non technical. I don't know if you are a manager but I seriously hope you know what you are worth
I don't believe OP knows anything about management.
@ac no more excuses now. We need to remove all these first line managers or else we will never get out of the hole. Every single manager needs to be looked at closer. I cannot think we need non technical managers managining technical folks
Yes, there are too many first line managers with too few reports, but that is not the biggest problem. There are too many management levels and the middle management layers need serious thinning. That was partially addressed in the 2007 "Spans and Levels" correction, but the problem has regrown since.
OP here and I have been here for 18 months. My manager on the other hand 15 years. I cannot tell you incompetent she is. Doesn't have a shred of technical knowledge. Manages 6 engineers however
The top 3 levels of management should be laid off. Those are id--ts without technical knowledge, yet making stupid critical decisions. They also consumed heavy salary budgets.
I came here to disagree, then thought about it for a few minutes. I think OP is right. I've liked my last few managers, but if I'm honest, other than them telling me what to/not to work on, I can't think of a way they helped me be more productive.
Looks like we still have first line managers down voting. Lol. Justify one of your jobs
Yes. Stop saying we need a manager for a manager to manage 5 people. If you cannot manage 5 people then you are either creating fake jobs and are incompetent yourself. Too many layers