If the market makes a turn soon, do you think there will be SAP layoffs? Any chatter, news or rumors?
29 replies (most recent on top)
for US 2024 VERPs its 4 weeks a year, with min of 3 years of service. emails go out tomorrow.
SAP is still a damn good company to work for with excellent products and market share. I've only had a few jobs in my 30 years of working and SAP is the best. And, with solutions like Ariba, Concur, success Factors, S/4, etc... and hopefully some new ones coming....it has done well. Stupid Qualtrics acquisition and silly, non profit making initiatives need to be less. We have very sticky solutions and high margin on many solutions. Definitely need more. Most importantly....we have way too many non-customer facing and non-development hiring and empire building. Too many "strategy" and "improvement" positions with a big pyramid under then. Gotta stop that. Internal circle of "busy-ness" is too high and will lessen profit margins. We are darn good company. Could be better but still damn good.
Is Palo Alto affected?
Test
Layoffs for SAP will be very bullish for the stock. Every tech company that is doing layoffs right now is only trimming underperformers and duplicate positions. This is an optimization phase for the corporations and very needed. This happens every recession cycle and is very health for companies. Let the layoffs and optimizations begin.
Cayk+1jUYPPlu
"But in 2023 macroeconomics are even worst and they cant do much but to lay off ppl first with higher salary ranges with bad performance and then to non-strategic post."
Well.. where do I start? First, the sentence is utter nonsense... "and then to non-strategic post." What does that mean exactly? Second, this statement about "higher salary ranges with bad performance".... simply just a re-hashing of the famous "time to cut out the dead wood" non-argument. You sound like someone who focuses on your own petty jealousy of senior colleagues who, much to your bewilderment, actually manage to maintain their roles, get good compensation, and promotion after promotion. You're either someone with limited experience who feels that he or she should be compensated exactly the same amount that someone with far more experience and ability receives, simply due to your own sad sense of entitlement OR you are someone who consistently under-performs and wears out his or her welcome everywhere they work, bouncing from one role, organization, or company to another every 2 or so years, expecting someone to recognize your unrecognizable talent. My recommendation: quit and move into your parent's basement.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-journal/id1469394914?i=1000593840583
Will Walldorf Developers be affected? Someone knows?
@Duug+1jUYPPlu
So... I think you are slightly confused. "VERPs" tend to be for colleagues with some history with the company who also happen to be within an age group (that age group is specific to location... so Germany is different than the US...) If a "VERP" (Voluntary Early Retirement Package) isn't offered to colleagues who joined in 2022-23, it doesn't mean they won't be given a severance package. Severance packages are different than VERPs. Now, if what you mean to say that colleagues who joined in 2022-23 won't receive any package... I really can't say either way. Personally, I find that the company tends to treat impacted colleagues rather fairly (fairness, of course, doesn't relieve the sting of being impacted.) Honestly, you sound like someone who is trying to stoke fear... making you just yet another chorus of fear-mongering lemmings seeking to undermine any sense of security that total strangers may have. And to what end? Who pays your salary?
@Bbba+1jUYPPlu
Email that went out by CK certainly seems to point to the inevitable! Layoffs are on the horizon."
What part of the email, exactly?
I looked for it... and I looked again... and again... and yet again. I'm looking at it right now. Don't see it.
So... help us all understand what "certainly seems" to point to layoffs.
Yes, customers are starting to notice the significant business value gap between SAP and competitors.
S4 migration costs are 5x+ too high. Significant non-value conversion activities as development was pushed to code something new to sell.
S4 common code based for public cloud is marketing spin. Client independent config and development language was never intended for a multi-client nor multi-tenet cloud environment. Nor can public cloud consequently achieve feature-set parity with on-premise or RISE hosted license model. Often competitive advantage and differentiation happens in development.
Once hosted outside of HEC, BPT makes less sense as it introduces additional points of failure, latency, and maintenance activities and outages.
How many band-aids? Cull the portfolio and allocate resources to win. Otherwise other cloud ERP vendors advantage win only grow. See Gartner and others for analyses.
The other concern is revenue per employee has been flat to declining when inflation adjusted for almost 15 years. Can’t get a decent raise when revenue per employee is half of competitors.
SAPers you’ve been led off the cliff by Walldorf political and nepotism. Good luck. I empathize however customers have choices and SAP hubris does not hear them.
I have recently joined sap, really worried looking at this thread:(
There will be no VERP for ppl who joined in 2022-2023. Lay off on horizon, Oracle replaced SAP in both revenue and new customers in ERP to be Nr.1. They have wide range of solution from Strong ERP solution portfolio, Public Hyperscaler services to Databases..
- SAP revenue vs Profit Margin decreased.
- No. Of employee: Hiring spree in 2021-2020 with 15% and 20% workforce on non-revenue generating or enabling position.
- Customer are jumping off SAP then continuing SAP rise.
In this way, SAP have to layoff around 12K ppl around the globe and atleast 6K would come from Germany without any severance pay as in 2021, they hired alone 10K.
BTW: SAP give only 6 months salary if you have completed probation and they release you immediately, else nothing.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/amazon-to-lay-off-over-17-000-workers-more-than-first-planned-11672874304
More bad news for tech sector
Past packages (VERPs) were decent. They have to be “competitive” outside of Germany with what would appease the Works Council in Germany, e.g., :
• 4 weeks severance per year of service (dependent on T level also)
• medical benefits cash lump sum or bridge to e.g. Medicare in US
What sort of packages have sap offered in the past ?
Who needs layoffs when so many are quitting SAP?
VERP different story… I hope it happens for you.
Without drastic portfolio simplification ongoing layoffs will further impact the solution and service quality, solution development velocity and feature-set.
But few past acquisitions can be sold and SAP execs don’t want to impact stock by writing down those acquisitions.
The current leadership spend so little time with customers outside a sales cycle that they don’t understand requirements nor solution lifecycle.
The only answer is to cull the portfolio and right-size the org.
Salesforce to Cut 10% of Jobs, Pare Offices as Sales Slow - 1/4/2023 8 AM CST US
Yes, SAP Already internally communicated that 2022 was rough and they stopped hiring as first measure But in 2023 macroeconomics are even worst and they cant do much but to lay off ppl first with higher salary ranges with bad performance and then to non-strategic post.
I read the email as well, and I did not come off thinking layoffs were coming.....
Email that went out by CK certainly seems to point to the inevitable! Layoffs are on the horizon.
@@xxbb+1jUYPPlu: which areas & which regions?
Any information on what orgs the managers are under NDA already?
Great statement of trust - internal NDA’s for our own managers LOL. Must be a Microsoft best practice
Any VERPs in the mix forthcoming?
Substantial numbers. Some managers under NDA already as they're asked to get their list ready.
Layoffs coming in 2023