Shouldn't we have gotten info on them? The last email said they would be effective this month
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Usually HR hides the compensation tab in Workday around comp adjustment time so you don’t see it before it’s communicated to you by your manager. They haven’t hidden it this year. Seems pretty obvious to me from discussions here that raises this year will be few and far between.
I appreciate the insight. I've reached out to my HR representative for any semblance of an explanation on the manner and have been ghosted several times.. Seems like to me that whoever is in charge of this process has been purposefully keeping things ambiguous and unclear, which I find infuriating -- at least have the dignity to tell us straight to our faces! At this point, the proof is in the pudding (the paycheck), unless they're changing when compensation updates take place too...
It's become quite obvious to me that this is not a place where long term growth is feasible, although given the job market, it might be smart to hunker down while quietly honing your technical chops.
Best of luck to everyone.
Has anyone heard about the raises that are supposed to be minimal but go into effect May1
Anything yet?
@2p9+1jre4bvgj Agreed. I blame the decline on their ignorance: building the wrong product, or building the right product badly.
Yet still there remain many caring and competent managers at SAS, doing their best in a difficult situation.
i"gnorant, abusive sycophants in management positions. They weren’t a majority, but a vocal minority with way too much influence. I blame them for the company’s decline."
Personality, good or bad, has little to do with it.
Software not embraced widely by users is the main cause of the company's decade of decline.
In my years at SAS, I saw many ignorant, abusive sycophants in management positions. They weren’t a majority, but a vocal minority with way too much influence. I blame them for the company’s decline.
But there were also conscientious, competent managers, doing the best they could to take care of their people.
I am glad for the employees that there are still some good managers left, doing their best under difficult conditions.
Hello @2jr+1jre4bvgj,
Ignore this fool:
@2jv+1jre4bvgj
and the id--ts who downvoted you, but upvoted them. You were right. Front line manager should tell their team the truth. That's what I did, because it's the right thing to do.
What truth is that?
"We are being put in a bad place and there isn't much we can do to help our teams."
Former manager here. Tell them the truth.
Front line manager here, team of 7-10 employees under me.
Messaging from SAS has been terrible from start to finish with this entire debacle and constantly changing. We were told early on that we would have the money to give raises to everyone in top quadrants of OTR, so team of 10, you'd likely have 3 or 4 there. In addition, we were told no problems promoting and those people would also get raises with.
So if I had a team of ten, messaging at one point would leave me to believe 3 or 4 would get raises, 1 or 2 would get promotions.
Then this changed with almost no notice a few weeks ago. It was "well we thought we could give you promotions and those raises, but now it'll likely just be promotions who get raises and that's it. Oh, promotions are going to be reduced too"
So I have told people "Hey, I put your promotion in, and I'm pretty sure you'll get it!" Because we put that in October and historically, it's not an issue especially for the lower level promotions. But now? Now we're being told that's changed and it su-ks being a manager who has to walk back that promise.
Long story short, we managers don't know what's going on and not all of us are compensation managers so we don't even get insight to that pool unless our director's tell us. We are being put in a bad place and there isn't much we can do to help our teams.
@2gd+1jre4bvgj Agree, talk to your manager. They are given a certain pool of money to work with, and it may have been less than expected.
@2gd+1jre4bvgj Your boss is likely in a tough spot versus being some conspiratorial villain.
Maybe you simply sit down and ask your manager…
@2c4+1jre4bvgj No.
My boss had said that I "would be guaranteed" a promotion this year. Given the fact that we are <4 working days removed from the end of April, in which salary bumps usually take effect, I am starting to smell the bs for what it is.
Don't you just love how transparent they've been about all of this, just like the IPO explanations, all smoke and mirrors.
So has anyone gotten a raise?
@205+1jre4bvgj The way some people talk about retiring in place they sure as sh-t should not be getting raises. Quite the opposite.
where are the raises?
they're gone like the interest from a would-be buyer of sas.
“ Granted, once those things start changing, SAS is gonna have a hard time keeping talent”
Hello 2019, it’s 2025 calling. We have a lot to catch you up on.
I do think there are reasons to stay at SAS, high pay ain't one of them to be sure.
However, the market is sh-t right now, SAS is relatively stable compared to a lot of other places, and the hours tend to be extremely flexible. I'm not expected to grind out 50 hours a week.
It's a comfortable job that's low maintenance.
Granted, once those things start changing, SAS is gonna have a hard time keeping talent
“There are many reasons to stay at SAS… And no I’m not going to bother explaining.”
Again: You have not stated any reason.
“ I suppose because you cannot.”
Supposing is your specialty…
“There are many reasons to stay at SAS… And no I’m not going to bother explaining.”
Again: You have not stated any reason -- I suppose because you cannot.
“ I once worked with a person whom I would deem incompetent. But they were "very nice", deferred to, and treated with kid gloves for some reason. I couldn't understand why.”
Maybe the other people knew something you didn’t? Or maybe you were right.
Who the he-l knows without knowing who you are talking about.
“Those of us quoting Peter Principle and Dunning-Kruger speak from years of experience”
As have those of us mocking you…
“ You have not answered the question — I suppose because you cannot.”
Suppose all you want. You can add it to the list of your other bad suppositions.
I once worked with a person whom I would deem incompetent. But they were "very nice", deferred to, and treated with kid gloves for some reason. I couldn't understand why.
Speaking of kid gloves, I suspect that someone didn't wear one after a heady night of Statistical consulting, long, long ago.
I was talking to someone at a recreational event. "My company paid for me to get my Master's degree!", they stated during our talk.
"My company had close ties to local flagship academia. All we got was A-Cappella University, and that was decades into the life of the company."
Compare and contrast. SAS is the BEST place to work!
Those of us quoting Peter Principle and Dunning-Kruger speak from years of experience. I saw many SAS managers promoted to positions beyond their competence. That’s how the company got where it is today.
”The job market is terrible… [otherwise] why in the world would anyone want to continue on at this company?”
“There are many reasons to stay at SAS… And no I’m not going to bother explaining.”
You have not answered the question — I suppose because you cannot.
@1j7+1jre4bvgj
@1j6+1jre4bvgj
@1j5+1jre4bvgj
What are the odds that the Three Amigos would show up and post within minutes of each other? Or is it one gruntled SAS employee defending the multi-billion dollar company and richest man in North Carolina's labor of love for the past 60 years? Whichever it is, your denial and refusal to face the realities of SAS is the thing that most causes me to suspect you don't work there, and never have, or that you're the very person Dunning-Kruger describes.
Queue the spittle-inflected rebuttal in 3... 2...
Dunning-Kruger this. Peter Principle that.
The anonymous thelayoff.com shrinks are out in full force.
Do these things exist? Yes.
Do random anonymous people shouting them whenever things don’t go THEIR way have any credibility in the matter? Absolutely not.
“ So many folks are staying because the job market is terrible right now. As soon as things improve there will be another mass exodus from SAS. Why in the world would anyone want to continue on at this company?”
There are many reasons to stay at SAS. Just because you don’t see them doesn’t mean they don’t exist. And no I’m not going to bother explaining. Pi----g into the wind on thewhine.com
I honestly don’t understand how you folks that are so negative and bitter stay and collect a paycheck. If I was that miserable money would not keep me there.
“ Dunning-Kruger and favoritism fully explain your observation. The ones that get the bonus imagine they "don't su-k", but that's Dunning-Kruger for a lot of the people left at SAS, since most of the ones with portable skills (the smart ones) have already left.”
Such horsesh-t
So many folks are staying because the job market is terrible right now. As soon as things improve there will be another mass exodus from SAS. Why in the world would anyone want to continue on at this company?
We were told today that there would be no raises unless you got a promotion
@198+1jre4bvgj
Hmm... Bonuses at SAS have been decoupled from performance for years. The recently departed Director of DevOps R&D once issued an edict that his managers had to choose someone on each team not to receive a bonus to "send a message" that no one is owed a bonus, and that you therefore shouldn't expect one. Not for performance reasons. Not because anyone was "questionable" or "dead weight". I asked if we could spread the bonus pool thinner, and he said no. I asked him if I could give that person my bonus, and he said no. Because that wasn't the point. The cruelty was the point. The message was the point. When I told him that I wouldn't do it, he chose for me.
Dunning-Kruger and favoritism fully explain your observation. The ones that get the bonus imagine they "don't su-k", but that's Dunning-Kruger for a lot of the people left at SAS, since most of the ones with portable skills (the smart ones) have already left. Most of the ones that are sure to get a bonus are someone's pet. They only imagine they have irreplacable technical skills. Everyone else is a "may get a bonus", and whether or not they do is based on an arbitrary decision some manager (or his boss, or her boss) made and none of the deciders have the courage or basic human decency to tell the person they just sc--wed it was their decision because they're fecking cowards, every last one.
I would say they are all very good and higher. These aren't unskilled people. They do their work. They don't call out sick all the time or anything.
Every one of them was shocked to hear they would get nothing. Managers felt badly but just kinda shrugged and said things like this has nothing to do with you, there's just significantly less money to go around this year, revenue and sales being down etc. Makes me think things maybe are worse financially than we realize.
@190+1jre4bvgj Honest question. Where would you say the people you know who didn’t get one fall? Not knowing is a valid answer.
Most people I know got one and I would say mostly fall in middle of pack to very good.
The ones I personally know who didn’t get one imho fall into the last two. There are only a couple but that is likely because they don’t want to talk about it.
Your mileage may vary on that and I am not even remotely saying that if you didn’t get a bonus that you su-k. Just that it is a possibility :)
- superstar
- very good
- middle of the pack
- questionable
- dead weight
My point is that I've been working here a really long time and never heard this before from anyone. Even the worst employees in my department got something every year. I've heard it from too many people this year. Things are changing.
I have talked to many people who have worked here for 10 years or longer and they did get bonuses.
I have talked to a few people who have worked here for 10 years or longer ans they did not get any bonus at all. First time for all of them and yes they're all in different parts of the company.
A company looking to retain employees does not do this. Or maybe only the very youngest ones have any value now.
Everyone in our department received a bonus. Approximately 40% have been submitted for raises. Last word was salary increases will be effective May 1.