Thread regarding ITT Educational Services Inc. layoffs

Bam

Yes the end seems a lot closer as of3.5hours ago.

No action reported from acic aswe all were afraid.THE DOE BOSS THE DOE

WELCOME TO THEWORLD.

BAM

Thanks irg

I hought I saw something with 24 hrs but that may have been co had to tell us after they got notified.by acic

Acic

may be gone in September .I meant to look at date April meeting council actions were posted.Just assumed it was done right away.thank again

The news about the outcome will come within 30 days of last weeks meeting. The ACICS website says

"As part of its recognition with the U.S. Department of Education, ACICS must notify the public within thirty days of its decisions regarding those institutions that are accredited or seeking accreditation.The Council is scheduled to meet three times during the year - April, August, and December."

(http://www.acics.org/councilactions.aspx)

And below that paragraph is a link that says "Review the most recent Council actions here." The link takes you to a Council Meeting document with results of the April meeting. That document seems to have been created around 30 days after April meeting -- from looking at document properties. So expect another link to be posted by Sept. 5, leading to document with results of August meeting.

On this same webpage are links to results from meetings for past several years. So can't imagine the pattern will be broken now. I have noticed that whenever a Council meeting document say that a company has been issued a show-cause directive, it is always followed up at the next meeting with some kind of decision -- deferred, lifted, accreditation suspended, there are several possible outcomes.

And elsewhere on the ACICS website, buried in the accreditation criteria somewhere, it says a lot of stuff about students and the public being notified about major decisions by ACICS immediately after the institution is notified. So Sept. 5th seems like the longest time we will have to wait. News should be out as soon as ITT-Tech is notified. In any case, it seems ITT-Tech would have to file something with SEC on ESI web page declaring result of show- cause meeting.

It sounds crazy, but I routinely check the SEC filings on ESI web page, the Layoffs forum, the ACICS council meeting results page, Myittexperience.com, and do google searches on key words, check a few campus web sites, etc. All of this to try and figure out what is going on, what the students have been told, etc, because the chicken s__t management refuses to do its job and keep us informed.

Another day.Nada.maybe we will hear from the council in October.If they are still around

Its like Aug 10.

Its like there was never a council meeting last week.

Maybe they postponed or canceled it.

Welcometomyworld

Silence

I got one stock people said we will hear in may.

Its now august SILENCE

NOTHING

WELCOMETOMYWORLD

"their are some serious accountability placed on educators for them to actually teach the students. We know this is unheard of for many but this is the expectation"

Of course there are many grads who have done well..otherwise ITT would have collapsed long ago. However this is probably 10 out of 100 enrollees who ever walked in the door.

Their certainly are instructors who are there "just to pass the time" & get paid, but that is probably 1 in 50.

Students must show up & also complete their assignments...having 25 students and only 10 assignments (sometimes less) ready to turn in on the due date...shows who might not be diligent. Students must be able to write coherent sentences, bring a pencil, not arrive 2 hours late every week for a 4 hour class. Too many have no car, broken car, repossessed car, no money for bus, under arrest, dui, etc--missing all these classes puts them behind. Also they can enroll 3 weeks into an 11 week class (!!!), so they are much more likely to drop or not pass.

I asked one programming student what made him want to go into IT & he said he didn't --that he wanted to be a EMS tech, but ITT didn't offer that & they had him go into computer programming!

I don't think he did more than 10% of the coursework.

Agree with @IrgOrJf-2dzf.

"educators that have their issues and maybe because their are some serious accountability placed on educators for them to actually teach the students. "

ITT tech placed no "serious accountability" on educators. What ITT Tech actually does does is try to:

1) have educators burn up time calling absent students at a time when they should be teaching students who are present.

2) Encourage educators to pass students who have simply not achieved a passing grade.

ITT Tech HQ systematically created an environment which encouraged massive grade inflation and academic fraud and which encouraged many good instructors to decline to teach at ITT Tech.

2hno,

Your post was difficult to understand, but this line is objectionable.

"educators that have their issues and maybe because their are some serious accountability placed on educators for them to actually teach the students. "

Many of us who "have issues" are dedicated educators who have struggled under ITT corporate to provide a valuable education to students. We ARE accountable, where HQ is not.

@IrgOrJf-2hno

Many ITT "graduates" got their jobs despite the poor quality of ITT's education.

ITT couldn't care less about whether instructors actually taught the students or not. All they cared about was that students were not dropped or failed and that the revenue kept on rolling.

P.S. You might want to check the on the correct use of "their" and "there".

I see some very bitter individuals commenting on ITT Tech and rightfully so. students who did not get all that was supposedly promised but its very interesting that their are graduates that have gotten jobs and are doing well with their ITT Technical Institute education, their are also educators that have their issues and maybe because their are some serious accountability placed on educators for them to actually teach the students. We know this is unheard of for many but this is the expectation.

but it is so easy to point fingers and blame others for our shortfalls, dedication, commitment,

If ITT would simply let those who want to attend, attend selling or influencing others—convincing others to change their minds or actions...

they would probably be much more successful.

At one time recruiters stood in the halls the first day of class, under the guise of helping enrollees find their classrooms...but they are mostly checking that they show up, so recruiters can immediately call them if they don't see them "sitting". Recruiters had to report their results at "boardrooms" where they could be properly admonished or put on corrective action.

"Accreditation probation means nothing to the students. Most of them have no clue about accreditation in the first place. If you don't believe me just ask your students who the accrediting body is?"

For students who are paying $2000 a class, it is shameful they did not learn about loans and accreditation in the first quarter. Shame on headquarters for screwing them over right and left, and keeping them selectively ignorant.

But you don't have to continue policy of ignorance. Last quarter I taught my students about the company structure -- CEO, COO, etc -- and verified the rumors that CEO is being investigated for fraud.

I made sure students understand credits don't transfer -- and told them their education was not as challenging as many other 2-year tech programs, and that was part of reason. Believe me, lots of them have kids themselves, and are not completely ignorant about education. Many ended up at ITT--Tech as a last resort, and are guiding their kids to better choices. They appreciated my honesty.

Besides, how many faculty knew about ACICS when they started working at ITT-Tech? Do you know what kind of degrees are required to transfer into local 4 year public colleges, in say electrical engineering or computer science? Do you know about ABET, and if ITT-Tech is approved by them? How many new faculty knew name of CEO, and amount he earns, when they started at ITT-Tech? Do you know when the next ESI quarterly earnings report comes out? Have you listened to Modany's investor conferences (when he still gave them)? When did you learn that recruiters follow a script when meeting with new students?

It's not like new faculty orientation fills people in on what they should really know about ITT-Tech. But lots of us have learned a lot over the years, through "self-study."

So, if you are a faculty member, and know about ACICS, and you are an experienced educator, then why not start teaching your students about accreditation? The topic should work for a variety of classes. Math, ethics, composition, problem solving, "strategies for a technical professional."

What can management do to you? Fire you in the middle of the quarter? Doubt they have a stack of applications for faculty wanting to teach at a failing college for low pay. The campuses are going to be closing due to low enrollment in the best of circumstances, so its not like an ITT-Tech job is going to go on much longer anyway.

Accreditation probation means nothing to the students. Most of them have no clue about accreditation in the first place. If you don't believe me just ask your students who the accrediting body is?

Even if they go looking, it is widely know that this school is a lot of why ACICS is getting shut down. No other accreditor is going to touch this place with a 40 foot pole.

Probation seems nearly inevitable for August at least.

Even if ACICS decides to suspend accreditation, ITT-Tech will likely appeal, and appeal puts them into probation mode while case is decided. At least, that is my understanding from reading ACICS accreditation criteria. So am guessing in short term, ITT-Tech will go on probation, whatever that means -- at least students have to be notified in writing that their school is on the rocks.

In September, it does seem like ACICS will get booted -- but they will likely appeal. Makes my head spin! I read somewhere that a school on probation can't switch accreditors, according to DoEd rules, to avoid "accreditor shopping" by crummy schools. But what happens to school on probation if their accreditor gets the ax? Looks like ITT-Tech is gearing up for teach out, so maybe management finally is looking ahead.

ACICS doesn't have time for a year long probation. ACICS themselves won't exist much past this meeting... If ACICS ever wanted to show some kind of backbone before they get forcibly booted, this would be the time.

part of other post (got chopped)

ITT Technical Institute PAC members provide their in-field knowledge and expertise by reviewing current ITT classroom curriculum, serving as guest speakers in partnership with our instructors as well as attending free campus professional networking breakfasts, luncheons and/or dinners. The ITT Technical Institute Program Advisory Committee meets for 2 hours, twice per year.

A school official is a person employed by the school in an administrative supervisory, academic or research, or support staff position; a person or company with whom the school has contracted; a person serving on an advisory board; or a student assisting a school official in performing his or her tasks. A school official has a legitimate educational interest if the official needs to review an education record in order to fulfill his or her responsibility.

ACICS should look closely at the Program Advisory Board (PAC) members. I know In our catalog there appear to be misrepresentations---at least one listed person retired several years ago, another moved away around 4 years ago, etc. There are to be sign in sheets to prove the participation of the advisory board members over these years---let ITT show that the meetings were held a person or company with whom the

school has contracted; a person serving on an advisory board; or a student assisting a school official in performing his or her tasks.

......are they listing school officials who don't exist?

We will soon find out! From ACICS criteria for accreditation, posted on its website,

"2‑3‑241. Imposition of Probation. Probation may be imposed by the Council either when it continues a show-cause directive after at least one hearing either in person or in writing, or after an institution has notified the Council that it intends to appeal a denial action.

The Council will notify the U.S. Secretary of Education, appropriate state regulatory agencies, other appropriate accrediting agencies, and the public of its decision to place an institution on probation. The institution is required to notify immediately in writing its current and prospective students that it has been placed on probation by its accrediting agency.

In the case of the public, however, the Council will provide written notice of the decisions listed below within 24 hours of its notice to the institution:

(a) A final decision to place an institution on probation or equivalent status.

(b) A final decision to deny, withdraw, suspend, revoke, or terminate the accreditation of an institution."