Ford’s crawling with shameless a-s-kissers who couldn’t do real work if their lives depended on it.
41 replies (most recent on top)
@w7 You're just in time to log off!
@w6 soz bozz. couldn't put down book.
i'm back now tho. logged in. eyes front. all deliverables. no doubt.
@vx Guys, this isn't philosophy class, get back to work.
@w1 Some of us came here to LEARN!
All these posters are bullsh-t.
@vv i'm the guy you're replying to and also @vt
You assume the guy's only motivation is self-interest and careerism, discounting any possibility they actually try pride in the work they do and it is their passion. It sounds like you're part of the problem. Like what you're describing is that very blanket cynicism. I agree with the management by platitude portion, like for example, whenever a wrong is done... mgmt would say "the past is that past" and then it would repeat over and over. To assume that someone leading a meeting or this and that is solipsism is risky because this could end up being crab in the barrel mentality. Skepticism is healthy, but people that do good work and provide real output should be treated fairly and not scrutinized while their efforts are extract and they themselves are reframed as not a team-player for shining too bright. That doesn't mean they're trying to come in and hop careers, or whatnot. If you're pointing at the person that said "go to meetings, interrupt with slightly relevant buzzwords and impatient anger. that will get you promoted" then yeah, that is truly oversimplification, in fact character as----------n through false or reframed narratives. Are you disloyal if you do a good job and benefit the company in various ways bringing more value and expect fair treatment? I don't think that warrants persecution or mobbing. Some of us have been doing this work for 15 years and are passionate. Some care about their reputation and integrity and also don't leave people hanging or holding the bag... faded beliefs in optimism can be harmful to people that simply just want to do their best, and also be their best through continuous improvement.. not a propped up narrative.... some of us mentor, teach others.. want to be ready for people that come when they need help in our lives... some of us have people in our lives that look up to us... trust but verify... the issue is we jump to just straight up violating others.. even if we know the truth...
https://thedecisionlab.com/biases/extrinsic-incentive-bias
https://nav.al/optimism
https://nav.al/rational-optimists
@ve+1k4b6qjtm for a long time i would assume positive intent and wondered why all the guys who had been there for a while were cynical. then i found out. ah ha. this guy is just doing things for his own career. he doesnt care what's good for the company, he just has to make it look like it's good for the company until he moves to his next job. rhetoric. solipsism. irrelevant analogies. over simplifications. management by platitude.
@vj yeah, i meant to say he said "be yourself, assume positive intent, and stay humble". It's usually the case, but looking back I learned that it doesn't apply in all situations.
A different mentor around the same time told me that Kanye once said in a song that "money isn't everything, but not having it is" and substituted the word money with opportunities. Looking back, what I learned was that sometimes we might take an opportunity because we don't want to block our blessings or self-sabotage, but now I understand something more than that. Ye, formally known as Kanye, also once said in a radio-show: "you don't got the answers, sway".
When you take the opportunity, and see multiple times where assuming positive intent goes the wrong way, you keep betraying your gut... and that moment when you betrayed it for too long and now you're stuck in a situation really su-ks. Sometimes, not having an opportunity is the real blessing, sometimes that opportunity that is dangled in front of us may trick us out our spot. Not having X is everything, but it doesn't have to carry a negative connotation where it is bad. It could be very good.
had a typo.
I also liked the slogan of the company he was at. It was something like do the right thing or something, that started hitting because I was learning about deontology and stuff around this time.
@td I also want to say to you that I think that is valid. I did that once really heavy in like 2017ish in regards to a business thing. I dropped a thing called "proof is in the pudding" with a person who I fell out with on one of my projects. As we both got older, they apologized and we became friends once again. It was essential to publicly drop my through though in that moment.
In another situation, I handled things the total opposite way from my instincts.
I believe a year and a half ago, I ran into a similar situation, but this time I was practicing/trying-out servant leadership and I made a mistake by letting some people in my camp guide my decision on a situation... their thought on the strategy was to remain quiet, remain quiet about misinformation from someone who was upset an agreement between us and them fell through where they pinned the deal failing on me and how "I ruined a good thing" by agreeing to their protest behavior where when they hinted to stop the deal instead of communicating productively what was bothering them.
Staying quiet was the wrong decision to make, because they made lies behind my back to individuals in my camp that weren't "higher-levels" who were even privy to the internal details of that deal since we kept it at those higher levels only. Hearing it from lower levels and staying quiet on the matter by giving it no mind made it so my truth wasn't in the picture for others to zoom out and see. I'm fine I made that decision because it is just a lesson and now I have a continuum from both sides of those situations. Gotta watch your house and be involved in discussions at each layer too or else misinformation can fester and lead innocent people to act in ways they would not have otherwise.
Both times were regarding context. But if you genuinely did make a mistake, yes, then that's is valid if you did something wrong in the first place. I agree with what you're saying on premise that there was in fact a wrong done. What you said is good advice under that pretense where you are in the wrong.
But also wrong is subjective, what are the surrounding the details? We can't just look at right or wrong.. we have to zoom out holistically and see the bigger picture. Looking for what is missing and filling that gap from both sides. For example, "oh he blew up the deal and ruined a good thing", maybe it could have been a very great thing, sure, but did "he" really mess up the deal? What is the context, the build up. Was it just off a whim?
@ve positive intent is usually the case…
@v0 Go to meetings, get asked to run the entire show because you're the only one informed on the subject, behind the entire architecture end-to-end, from design to implementation. Use all the right terminology everyone expects you to already know, keep the knowledge transferring -- and that’s how you get fake-promoted. Then watch them reframe with what you just said about using "buzzwords" or "interrupting" because you don't know the relevant terms that are simply normal nomenclature they are supposed to know in their position or at least to lookup or ask, just to justify suppressing you. There a two hour KT session in Ford's possession, dare they look at it?
@td+1k4b6qjtm Yeah, I agree with getting your stuff out in the open. However, dangers of a single story is a great lesson because sometimes we don't know what is said behind closed-doors and it could be absolutely false yet taken at face-value due to a bad actors authority/credibility. It's a false dilemma to assume that if someone has the opportunity to backstab you that it's because something was wrong in the first place and they have to now vindicate themselves by being radically transparent. A director (that was) at Ally Financial (and mentor), once told me when I was much younger (18ish) that I should be myself, positive intent, and be humble. Sometimes, we need to remember to assume positive intent.. until proven otherwise, ask Suzanne
go to meetings, interrupt with slightly relevant buzzwords and impatient anger. that will get you promoted.
@h6 If someone has the opportunity to backstab you well you usually did something wrong in the first place. Get your sh-t out in the open, check them when they try to backstab, you’ll have more credibility.
@h6 this seems a little misplaced.
It's now becoming a sport. Don't forget to add a "backstabbing your co-worker" as part of the rules.
@bd Ford C-Suite claims we are a startup that's why we have billion dollar losses
@e3 Too funny.
@e2 Dio perdona... io no!
@e1 God still loves you.
@e0 Happy to help!
@dz Can’t block blessings. God sent a boat (@dn) as a reminder that the company was bending over backwards and this was just miscommunication.
Should have said "thank you, FMC!" instead.
@dn Oh, so everything i experienced from Ford as a minority was simply them bending over backwards for me!
I must've been so confused until you clarified what this company was doing to me.
I thought it was exploitation!
Thank goodness you clarified!
@dn So, coming from a protected class and my own personal experiences with Ford, I disagree with the fatality to cover complexity. They use the futility technique and emotional-love approach. The goal is to make the subject feel resistance is useless. It may look that way, but only because you may never hear negative stories come to light.
Giving up means going back to letting things happen as a way to protect your peace or to accept the damages that happened. It relies on past scenarios where examples are made to send a message like "everyone that defended themselves lost their dignity", which plays on existing doubts to exploit fear of retaliation, smearing, isolation, or humiliation.
The goal is resigned cooperation through psychological manipulation. Cooperation (or silence) becomes a matter of survival, not agreement.
If a company like Ford hurts their community, hoards state funding, or exploits labor but still claims to be “ethical” or more related to your comment “on equal footing” the moral framework becomes meaningless.
If a company can lobby to change regulations in its favor, then the "rules" are not equal, and therefore not truly just.
This highlights illusion of fairness when systems are rigged rim to favor the powerful. The people that existed before you. Which also draws attention towards gatekeeping. Existing power empowers compliance, leaches creativity, and undermines its own execution.
@dj this place bends over backwards to cater women and minorities
The concepts of law, rules, and morality only hold meaning if they are based on equality.
You cannot reason with a tiger when your head is in its mouth.
Just look at the talentless Ford family in so many leadership positions across the company. What made you think talent was valued here? When the company tells you they are a family, you should trust them.
Absolutely, and people have passed on this skill generation after generations, that’s why you see grandpa to intern from same family surviving while talented people are let go, lick baby lick😆
@bd they will not be because they don’t have the skill or desirability to get those jobs
please file a suit against us. can't wait!
No.
@bd That's rich! I was told i was!
@at I am also planning to leave before the end of the year
All of you on this thread should go work at a startup instead, if you have this many problems with corporate america
Everyone, literally everyone knows this. Welcome to corporate America!
It’s not what you know but who you know here. Our management gets a high with all these brown nosers all around us. No wonder we cannot deliver anything on time.
You can tell which ll5s never learned how to manage peopl. They should at the very least get remedial training st minimum and an improvent plan..
I am giving my self 3 months max to get the he-l out of my department why a terrible ll5 and and a not so great supervisor. If that means I am out of ford fine by me I would even take a pay cut that's how bad my management is right now.
You guys are engaging in slander
It’s always been that way at Ford. Literally from the beginning.
Dude, welcome to the real world. You should have taken the blue pill.
The most important criterion to get promoted is to kiss the assess of those 1-2 levels above you
Yup. "Perception" of performance