Thread regarding Boeing Co. layoffs

Boeing will probably bring in a couple hundred people to get P 47 into production. A lot of of these people will come in expecting to have a long-term job and buy houses, etc. only to find out that Boeing is Laying at least half of them off after three years.

They should just bring in a couple hundred contract engineers pay them well and then when they get laid off three years later, there’s no hard feelings and they appreciate the opportunity instead they will just treat a couple hundred direct employees like contract employees without the pay. It’s a very ugly business to work in.

I don’t recommend contract employment at Boeing. They are constantly laying off direct employees. You can only imagine how much more often they will lay off contractors.

If you’re looking for a job, obviously Boeing is not gonna be your first choice, but I would suggest trying to find a direct position. simply the constant stress of wondering if you’re getting laud off, it’s not good for your health.

Boeing contract rates are not very good anyways. They generally have a hard time finding contractors combined with the fact that they will lay people off at a drop of a hat.

I never witnessed any women or black employees being laid off during my time at Boeing. I did see a lot of older white male employees get warn notices though. Coincidence? I doubt it.

Laying off a bunch of direct employees a week after laying off contract employees doesn’t sit well with most of the employees.

The only difference between direct and contract is you’re lower pay.

When Boeing started treating the majority of their direct employees, no better than their contract employees this was an indication of the direction the company was going. Boeing employees are treated a little better than temps today.

It’s just more incentive for people to find a different industry to work in.

Lockheed cut 8 Contractors working in Marietta GA and 3 working in Ft Worth TX today.
They were given notice when they showed up for work and told not to bill any hours for the day and to leave Lockheed facilities.

Hang on it's getting rough out there.

Due to losing the NGAD, Lockheed isn't wasting anytime cutting Shoppers. They will go after the directs next by declaring a RIF. The F-35 program can't absorb all their former NGAD staff.

Will things get bad at Boeing?? Maybe not right now but mostly things will.

@14q+1jqd76j5y
After the Sikorsky episode in 2002, I marked up my contracts with the contract houses to state that if the rate was ever reduced and the contractor does not agree to the reduction, the contract house agrees to lay off the contractor. In this way, I can leave and draw unemployment until I find my next job. Sometimes I have to drive 2000 miles in order to get to a jobsite. As a matter of principle, I am willing to leave certain jobs if the client is willing to break contract law.

@13t+1jqd76j5y

Back in 2015 or so, Boeing cut contractor hourly rates and cut back on contractors working overtime, pretty much eliminated overtime in the program I worked in. St Louis is a tough sell to start with for Boeing to even find directs or even contractors willing to move there to work even now. None of these drawbacks stopped Boeing from cutting contractor hourly rates back then.

Shopper's mantra: Chaos means cash. Lots of chaos at BA.

@vs+1jqd76j5y
Sikorsky cut shopper's rates mid-contract in 2002 as well, right after 9/11. They took advantage of the economic downturn. Shoppers don't forget when someone messes with their money. A few years later, Sikorsky had difficulty getting shoppers to work for them. Memories like elephants.

if you want to work for this total sh1t show company keep it temporary

Suite or suit?

I get impossible due dates forced on me all the time, usually by leads or managers or both. My Boeing manager doesn't even acknowledge my presence, and my coworkers have told me manager openly talks down about me behind my back. My feelings are hurt. Where can I file a discrimination suite?

Boeing, Lockheed, Northrup, GE etc. are now all low-balling on hourly rates they are offering to pay for their current contract engineering job postings. No more remote opportunities listed, all jobs are on-site. Seen this happen before. These companies, including Boeing will even cut the hourly rates for contractors they already have on staff, telling the contractor to except their hourly rate cut or they will be dismissed. Maybe the aero industry is heading into a downturn. If you are a contractor and your end date is approaching, it could be a great time to look into contractor jobs in other industries to get out of Seattle or Saint Louis leaving Boeing in the rearview mirror. Thats how I did it, and don't regret it at all.

After reading these comments about discrimination/not discrimination, I have some concerns about the community at large. BA has had a lot of problems ever since the 1998 takeover by MacDac. The Max and 787 are garbage. Whistleblowers who tried to do the right thing are reviled and commit su----e. Are you a part of the problem, or are you a part of the solution.

Lots of people at Boeing - men, women, directs and contractors get thrown unrealistic deadlines to have work done. Happens all the time with people at Boeing as well as at other companies. Been like this for me the last four years since I started working in the Boeing group I do now. I just work the best I can and get the work done I’m given to do in what I feel is a reasonable amount of time. I don’t debate my Boeing manager about it. I think it’s a stretch saying you are being discriminated against because you get thrown a tough deadline.

Post ID: @h4+1jqd76j5y

Sounds like you were a contractor at Boeing for 22 months.
You say you were discriminated against, how so? Are you sure male contractors weren't being treated the same?

As far as discrimination goes. There is a Boeing mid-level manager who told one of their Boeing direct employees with a disability, who had recently joined the manager's group that they did not agree with the Boeing Company in hiring people with the same disability. So, this Boeing mid-level manager, who is still with Boeing sure sounds like they are not worried at all about the possibility of discriminating against this direct employee by telling the person this.

This company will use an abuse contractors, keep renewing contracts while not making them permanent cuz the regular badges would lose their damn mind.

The problem is that they are going to need to hire more people for what is to come.

What I personally witnessed at Boeing is thus pecking order:

At the bottom: women of color contractors
Next to the bottom: all other contractors
Next: women employees
Next: people of color employees
Next: employees over 50
At the top: white men

We all have a different perspective based on the group of which we belong. I told my last BA lead that I would not wish womanhood upon my enemy. He was such a beautiful person. He did not give me the guy eyeroll. He crossed his arms, leaned against my desk/bookcase, and said, "Is it that bad?" It was a genuine open ended question. Great mentor and lead and leader. He was a senior lead, a white male, that had worked at the company for 30+ years. Unfortunately, our first-level BA manager was corrupt as F. He discriminated against me from my 3rd week of employment through my 22nd months of employment. Allowing timecard fraud in our group on the cost-plus military project while riding my back like a horse he was trying to break. 3 times he would assigned a drawing to me on one day and tell me/my lead that he wanted me to get it done by the end of the next day. 2 of those drawings were 40 hours of work; 1 of those drawings was 160 hours of work. Remember Nowak who wore a diaper from Houston to Orlando so she wouldn't have to stop for bathroom breaks? Even if I was chained to my catia and wore a diaper, I would not be able to finish a 40 hour drawing job in 24 hours. So you will have to excuse me if I disagree with the blogger who said women are at the top of the pecking order.

I feel Boeing destroyed contract engineering, in the aerospace industry. There used to be a large percentage of contract engineers in aerospace companies. Their purpose was in case of a financial downturn. They wouldn’t need to layoff a large number of direct employees. They could cut back to no contract employees.

however companies like Boeing became so obsessed with financial results. They simply treat direct employees like contractors. They would think nothing of simply hiring a couple hundred direct employees and only employing them for one or two years and then laying them off.

It’s one of the reasons that the aerospace industry has become a bad career choice in my opinion. They treat engineers as contract employees. But at a much lower pay.

What I personally witnessed Twerking several years at Boeing is thus pecking order:

At the bottom: contract engineers
Next to the bottom: white men over 50
Next: general employees over 50
Next: black employees
At the top: women

This was just the general order of what I saw and witnessed in terms of people being laid off or promoted, etc.

Women and blacks were generally very safe and did not have to worry about layoffs and we’re always given promotions.

Contractors and white men over 50 were always on the chopping blocks.

Boeing tried to layoff all their contract engineers. They discovered the state of hiring contract engineers, they can just treat the direct engineers as contractors. They can just lay off the direct engineers instead of the contract engineers and save money.

No matter what position,shop,engineer ,employee ,2 level ...all treated like hot garbage!!!
Boeing only cares about production not PEOPLE !! Company is a disaster !!

If direct hires are treated poorly, how do you think contract hires are treated: they are treated exponentially worse. Contractors are treated like dog excr-ment. They're the scapegoat of direct sc--wups and mistakes. They are defamed and discriminated against. Some are se-----y harassed. They have no rights. Directs and companies can do anything to a contractor, and they can't do anything about it. They are highly compensated slaves. I contracted for 12 years. I'd rather make $10/hr and be treated like a human. Good luck.

I'll take contract engineering once I retire. few weeks of work now and then, charge $150/hr, whats not to like? I am an expert in what I do, so they will so product from em.

So true. When companies stopped caring about people. People stopped caring about them. End of story.

If you want to experience a true sweat shop, you could accept a contract job at Blue Origin.