Everybody is talking about age discrimination like it's a foregone conclusion. It's something that's happening and it's something that'll continu happening and that's that. Is that really the case? Age discrimination is illegal, should we really be accepting it as if it's something normal and unavoidable?
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The stock price must rise! - Give me 3% you peasants.
It is and has been Age Discrimination sine AM took over. The reality is that it has been carefully woven into the long range business plan for the past eight years, and carefully embedded into several rounds of “Work force reduction” to disguise it as just the normal annual culling of the herd!
The last “age based” mass removal, was woven into the economic downturn, due to COVID! They used the pandemic to leverage a buy out / voluntary retirement of a tremendous number of liabilities.
So the bigger questions should be, “How significant has the median age of employees dropped from 2013 to present?” And... by percentages, based on demographic, How much has the over 50 number of employees decreased with each year of layoffs?
If the answers to those questions can be gathered, we will see that the devil is in the details!
Hah "Fire/fire" and "age of event". Not sure what my brain did there. Must be because I was already 30 when Enron hit the news. :)
"The poster who said to get some data from HR is a good start. We can request HR to provide their age-related hiring and firing data."
(Putting on my data glasses) And what would that data look like? Is it a spreadsheet that lists all hires and all fires by age? And what does that prove? That data is absolutely useless in isolation - in fact, it's worse than useless. It's dangerous.
What would be needed is then to drill down into each hire and fire, and determine whether it was deserved, appropriate, and handled correctly/ Then, by disclosing the details of an (ex-)employee's history, you're deeply in violation of privacy laws, and you've got people making subjective assessments of each case, each one easily challenged because, they're... well... subjective.
In such a simple analysis as hire/hire and age of age, the NFL is wildly ageist.
"Hmmm....I guess you weren't born yet when Enron or WorldCom happened."
Not sure if you're being deliberately obtuse, but neither Enron nor WorldCom had anything at all to do with systemic discrimination. The people who went to jail did so through criminal prosecution.
Things like age discrimination, although technically legislated against in Canada, don't lead to individuals being prosecuted for illegalities.
Good breakdown: http://www.agediscrimination.info/international-age-discrimination/canada#:~:text=The%20federal%20government%20and%20all,on%20the%20basis%20of%20age.
I fail to see how the last two posts, for instance, are proof of anything. I don't think you understand what "proof" is.
Neither has anything to do with racism.
These posts are proof of the racism that is rampant at this organization.
"BIPOC"
Nope. All done learning new acronyms. Go away.
gender studies degree not opening too many doors for ya bro?
Union Gas is equally discriminatory against BIPOC. If you are a black, indegenous or a brown person this is not the place for you.
"Excellent idea. Will that be cash, debit, or credit?"
Maybe, you can get some inspiration from Erin Brockovich. If you don't like reading her book, you can enjoy watching Julia Roberts.
"Well, okay. But let’s maybe show an example of where each group has successfully been made to pay in the past before we go charging down the path."
Hmmm....I guess you weren't born yet when Enron or WorldCom happened.
Enbridge discriminates against women, BIPOC, LGBTQ and most people over age 50. Who does that leave? Oh, yeah. White men. Take a look at the board, ELT and most leaders who are at the director level or above and tell me this isn’t true.
Because Canadians have a much better pension safety net provided by the government. At 65 they can get Canada Pension from the government (up to 14K a year if you have the years in) You can start taking this at 60 somewhat reduced, plus you get Old Age Security on top. This gives you security later on allowing you to retire earlier on your Company pension, which if you worked at Enbridge Canada you would have a defined pension plus they was matching RRSP's etc etc. If you years in the pension is good and you should be able to get out between 55 and 60
Speaking of age isn’t AM ready to be put out to pasture?
Speaking of age, why does it seem that people in the US offices work to a much older age than Canada? Do people retire much later in the US in general?
Enbridge should be upfront about the matter, and let its new hires know that only a percentage of employees will be allowed to retire to the point where they will receive their full pension.
HR should tell new employees that a majority of them will be let go as they approach age 50, as many will be considered too expensive for the company and easily replaced with someone younger.
It’s only fair that the company be honest about what really happens.
“ We can then hire a lawyer to file a court case to force HR to release the data on allegations of age discrimination.”
Excellent idea. Will that be cash, debit, or credit?
“We will make the execs, directors and managers pay for their selfish illegal behaviours.”
Well, okay. But let’s maybe show an example of where each group has successfully been made to pay in the past before we go charging down the path.
“2) They’re tech-savvy: having grown up with computers, technology is second nature to them”
Having worked IT - especially on the security side, you’d be surprised how many “young” people don’t understand technology, or worse, they simply don’t care about the security side of things.
This is good reference about age discrimination
https://ca.topresume.com/career-advice/what-is-age-discrimination
The poster who said to get some data from HR is a good start. We can request HR to provide their age-related hiring and firing data. We can expect the request to be turned down. We can then hire a lawyer to file a court case to force HR to release the data on allegations of age discrimination. We will make the execs, directors and managers pay for their selfish illegal behaviours.
It's illegal in Canada too. It's been tough to prove in courts of law but it's high time to hold these arrogant unethical corporations somehow accountable for their illegal hiring and firing practices.
Age discrimination is already illegal in the US!
We can lobby our lawmakers to modify the law on affirmative action to include age and not just race, gender, religion or ethnicity.
When an older, qualified job applicant is turned down by a hiring manager because he or she is not a "good fit", it usually means the applicant is too old and not "unqualified" . We all know the hiring process is more of a subjective than an objective process.
Welcome to the merry-go-round of hiring younger, "educated" university/college grads into roles with salaries half of what "old people" are earning.
1) They’re cheaper: younger employees, as a general rule, earn considerably less than veteran employees with years, perhaps decades, of experience;
2) They’re tech-savvy: having grown up with computers, technology is second nature to them;
3) They’re not yet creatures of habit: younger workers, it’s thought, adapt more readily to change.
Great article in last February's Forbes - Older Workers Deserve Your Company’s Love Too
I would like to see any stats from HR about the ages of new hires and the ages of those who were competing for the same job.
We need to see data from other companies as well. I believe it is happening but we need to prove it.
The hiring managers also need to be re-oriented about this hiring policy otherwise they can be charged with age discrimination.
When does age discrimination kick in?
After 50?
Old lives matter? That's great. Why not? It should certainly be a movement after what we have seen how Covid has revealed about the c-appy for profit rest homes. Not to mention, of course, the general age discrimination occurring in the workplace and in society.
Well, if you make it to ELT, you won’t be discriminated against. Al must be at least 70.
March can be old people history month, we can share old people stories
Start a movement - OPLM. Old people lives matter. Demand justice by defundng the ELT. OR ask for a big Reparation if canned / layer off. Other ideas are welcome.