It's the only question anyone cares about.
25 replies (most recent on top)
Dear CoCer - Thank you. You hit the nail on the head. My experience with this debacle is the same. Only difference is that I'm still stuck in this nightmare.
LAPC here and now gone via COC after waiting for 9 months and turning down several oxy opportunities. I was first offered a role to "join" oxy under a person who had many years less exp than me to do their former job. (they were promoted just before we started integration). After letting them know that I previously managed an entire team of people doing that at APC with a larger budget, I laughed at them. I then watched over the next 5 months offer the same role to 5 others whom also turned it down.. 2 mostly due to the inexperienced a hole who they put in as "director" for a dept of 3. The other 3 mentioned that the actual work would take them back in their career progression. So when you say APC was overpaid to OXY peers, it's not comparing Apples to Apples. When comparing legacy orgs it was very clear that org structure in OXY was mgmt inflated. It has been mentioned on here several times but look at sevaral non-technical functions. HR at APC had one VP and oxy has/had min 3. IT, Supply Chain and HSE are similar when comparing middle to upper mgmt inflation by OXY orgs. LAPC was given more autonomy (than LOXY peers) to accomplish goals and that led to greater experience which, in turn, leads to higher pay. So please stop comparing titles and pay and look at the roles these LAPC people were doing before you label them overpaid. Most of us have already landed higher gigs anyway along with a fat COC.
I am asked repeatedly if I have heard about the horrors going on now. My biggest reply to all the questions is that I state that Oxy was in over their head the minute they counter offered. CVX and everyone since has out maneuvered Oxy in every way. Internally, Oxy wasnt ready or experienced in any dept to take on the LAPC assets/business or it's workers. I was part of a company wide project that met one last time and I was deeply concerned that even after 4 months in, most of the LAPC folks didnt even have a departmental gathering, and most LAPC workers had not even been welcomed or even contacted by an OXY counterpart. Bitterness and cold reactions from LOXY workers and mgmt made it worse for them. Even as redundancies were removed, things didnt change and now it appears mgmt still has yet to close this gap.
OXY is circling the drain of Bankruptcy faster and faster. Shares will be diluted again when Oxy pays Buffet in shares for a 2nd time. It's almost impossible to right the company ship when talent will have walked or have walked since the acquisition from both sides.
Good luck to those still needing it there.
LAPC (in my department) were enabled, empowered, and got s—t done. We ran lean and were renowned in the industry for how much we were able to accomplish with so few. This justified the compensation. Now we’ve been neutered. No more trust. No more empowerment. No more incentive to deliver outstanding results.
@1lyo: LAPC here who was fortunate to leave. I may have been overpaid at APC by your standards, but I also received a nice raise by joining another company in the industry, and this wasn't the only offer I received which would have been a raise. So I can tell you that I wasn't overpaid compared to the rest of the industry. I also know many others who can say the same thing. Most of us that moved on gained jobs prior to the current downturn, so it may be a different story now. However, don't go around claiming that we were overpaid compared to the industry when that isn't true in at least quite a number of cases. Now, if Oxy underpays their employees, then that's a completely different story, but that's not APC's fault. Best of luck to you all, as it sounds like those who are left (both LAPC and LOXY) are having a rough time right now. Many of us hope for the best for you.
From the corporate level, there should have been a side-by-side analysis done asap after the merger, that's what competent, experienced companies do in an acquisition. Of course that did not happen due to Oxy's lack of experience. But from an individual level, if the shoe fits...
Using APC salaries as a comparison for market value is a mistake. They were way overpaid compared to the rest of the industry. Good for them, but not a realistic comparison.
Unfortunately without an experience/position adjusted side by side comparison of compensation data between both companies (read: actual facts) this will be a pointless speculative argument.
Beg to differ with @vmi on this statement: "We were already paid below market before the salary cut (look at APC salaries for the same position and you will realize how true this is)."
Before comparing OXY-APC salaries, look at the experience level and professional competencies that both groups bring to the table. LAPC might make more than their LOXY counterparts, but depth of experience and professional credentials make the difference.
@imx+15aVGw8S sounds like JB.
Encouraging people to leave so they don't get severance is many levels too advanced for GV.
So funny the person who keeps saying “leave oxy if you don’t like it” - sounds like any of VH’s minions you know like Hawaiian shirt boy, bully short Ken, any executive working the Permian...
Dang I could not have agreed more with what was said in the comment immediately below. Well put! OXY will have a brain drain and exodus of talent like never seen before! Most of us are just waiting around to get either laid off or as soon as things recover leave on our own. This is coming from a 10 year legacy OXY employee who showed nothing but loyalty to OXY over the years. You do not treat your employees like cattle (unless your OXY) and think that it is okay. We were already paid below market before the salary cut (look at APC salaries for the same position and you will realize how true this is). Now we aren't paid even close to what we are worth.
Dang I could not have agreed more with what was said in the comment immediately below. Well put! OXY will have a brain drain and exodus of talent like never seen before! Most of us are just waiting around to get either laid off or as soon as things recover leave on our own. This is coming from a 10 year legacy OXY employee who showed nothing but loyalty to OXY over the years. You do not treat your employees like cattle (unless your OXY) and think that it is okay. We were already paid below market before the salary cut (look at APC salaries for the same position and you will realize how true this is). Now we aren't paid even close to what we are worth.
What makes you assume I’m not leaving? Spoiler: I am. I’m not whining. Just starting an opinion. You are the one stuck with the pay cut while I will be getting my full salary from the VSP. But you are right, the market dictates my value. And yours. But the market also dictates the value of Oxy as an employer vs. other companies. In the future, if someone is comparing two similar offers, they are probably going to pick the offer from the company that doesn’t have a history of making sudden, drastic cuts to the salary they agreed upon. So Oxy will either have to pay more to get more talented employees, or accept less talented employees. It cuts both ways. Bottom line, the employees didn’t have a say in the acquisition, which was a risk management nightmare and an act of corporate governance malpractice. Now that I think about it, the shareholders didn’t have a say either. And the employees and shareholders are the ones suffering the consequences. But go ahead and sit on your high horse and look down on the poor “whiners” who are upset because their employer unilaterally altered the terms of the employment agreement they made when they accepted their job. At the very least, they should do what more respectable companies in the industry are doing and cut working days proportional to salary. In the end, this will hurt Oxy. The industry is small, and it takes a long time for people to forget.
We didn’t choose to take a pay we shouldn’t be lucky we have job we ( LAPC ) we just want what is do to us COC. So I don’t feel lucky to have anything this is what I earned this company doesn’t care about any of us and they have showed that time and time again
So much whining, but so little action.
The market dictates your value, not your feelings. This is a simple concept that most seem to struggle with on this message board.
If you are unhappy with your compensation you should leave. Otherwise, appreciate what you have and work hard to add value to your company and peers.
You are free to make career moves and make as much money as your heart desires. Good luck!
@ehx+15aVGw8S I hate to break this to you but employment isn’t a hobby. Most people work out of a need for survival and that survival is possible from the money they earn. It’s mo–nic to think anyone shouldn’t acknowledge their worth or be compensated fairly for the services they perform.
LOL why in God’s name would I sacrifice my time and energy for any reason besides money? That’s twisted.
To the troll below please p*ss off. Off course we are only motivated by money. And to the employee who said a 3.5% raise when times are good and a 30% pay cut when management drives the company into the ground. I couldn’t have said it better. Everyone who is worth their weight will leave oxy and many probably will leave the industry as soon as this turns around. You cannot pay your people 30% below market and expect anything different.
You should probably find work in a different industry or at a different company if all that motivates you in your current situation is money...
Have you considered seeking counseling to work through the issues you’re currently struggling with?
Ahhh yes. When profits are high, congratulations on your 3.5% raise. When management drives the company into the ground, congratulations on your 30% pay cut. If you don’t like it, take a hike. No wonder we attract the best talent.
The fact it took her so long shows how out of touch the honchos on 31 really are.
And then to not give a definitive answer at all tells us all we need to know. If they had any class at all they would have scheduled this before the deadline for the voluntary resignation auction.
No one is forcing you to work at Oxy. If you don’t like it, leave.
Why can't she just furlough us a few days a week so we can get unemployment benefits!!!!!!!!!!
Still planning for it to be reviewed end of August. Not that anything positive will come out of that.
She just said it. No idea about the economy or oil prices and no idea when we'll get our salary back. I guess we should get used to our 30 percent cut.