Thread regarding Intel Corp. layoffs

People who think only deadwood is getting fired - it's not so simple

Ok, so I can agree that getting rid of some dead weight in a huge company like Intel is sometimes necessary, but the problem with ACT is that it didn't get rid of dead weight. I am a front line manager, so let me give you a little insight into what happened from manager perspective:

In the last Focal, managers were forced to find people who'd get SSL 4. So they did. These people were not necessarily the worst people in the teams. Often, they were simply people who did not perform well in the last year only. Often, managers just picked someone and gave them a higher raise to compensate for the lower SSL. In some cases, team members even agreed to get a lower SSL because they preferred a higher raise. All of this happened, because nobody knew that SSL 4 would imply getting an ISP. So a lot of people got ISPs who didn't deserve it. And a lot of people who deserved ISPs didn't get one.

Same with VSPs. Those were given mostly to people who didn't get EE ratings for 3+ years. Well, most team managers nowadays have development plans for their teams, because of restricted raise/rating/promotion possibilities. If you have a team of 10 people, you can give two EEs per year - perhaps three if you are lucky. So managers know exactly whom to give which rating in which year to get them promoted. They are not only giving performance-based ratings but also strategic ratings. In my team, I gave an EE rating to one team member, because he had an EE two years ago, so I had to give him an EE this year to promote him (he was overdue, really). Otherwise, the old EE would have been lost (you need two EEs in three years to promote people). So I did not give an EE to another team member who really would have deserved it, but instead I used my promo budget to give him a higher raise (which made him happy) and marked him as a definite candidate for EE next year. But now he got a VSP because of that and left. He wasn't dead weight. He was essential for my team, for our next product and for our key customers. But the VSP made him feel unwanted, no matter how much I begged him to stay. If I had been given a choice, I would have picked another guy to remove from the team.

Why are the managers not given a choice? Because Intel doesn't trust the front line managers to make managerial decisions. There's all this talk about how we are leaders. But we're only asked to be leaders after the fact, to clean up the mistakes made by upper management. Now we're asked to act like leaders and bring the teams back on their feet after ACT. But we were not allowed to be leaders during ACT by actually picking the real low performers. We are not allowed to act like leaders in Focal, because we're given highly restricted budgets for raises and SSL which force us to play silly games with the raises, SSLs and promotions which in turn gets the wrong people fired.

It's not like Intel really wants us to be leaders. We front line managers get zero trainings, except for some nebulous leadership nonsense that has no connection to Intel reality. But we don't get trainings about how to properly identify and deal with low performers, how to create a healthy fluctuation that keeps the company healthy, and so on. Yes, I am sorry to say it, but your are being led by managers who are flying by the seats of their pants and who are being led by managers who blindly execute whatever they are told and who in turn are being led by managers who think every team, no matter how small, can be rated on a bell curve - or that they have to be rated on a bell curve, because front line managers can't make managerial decisions.

So no, don't think that ACT removed deadwood. It removed 12,000 people - many of them important to the future of the company. It did so because of a lack of trust in front line management - which is to some extent justified because Intel doesn't care about empowering and educating front line management. We front line managers are useless idiots. Or at least we're being treated like ones. Doesn't matter, the end result is the same.

I am now looking for a new job, because I am sick of not being trusted to do my current one. I am sick of telling people in Focal that "successful" is a good rating and then having to admit that it was a lie. I am sick of being asked to "lead" only when it's time to clean up messes I did not create. I am sick of being forced to give ratings that may or may not cause my team members to get fired. I am sick of being told to do strict performance management, while the manager four levels above me didn't have anyone from his staff removed, indicating to me that nobody at that level got ISPs or VSPs - which looks like a case of zero performance management to me.

I didn't get a VSP, sadly. I asked my boss to give me one and he refused. He openly told me he asked the same from his boss and didn't get one either. Misery likes company, I guess. So I will go without the package. Got my fifth interview tomorrow. Looking great so far. Giving up my RSUs could imply an unpleasant pay cut, but right now, I just want out.

Sorry for the long post, but I had to vent. ;-)

by
| 9191 views | | 43 replies (last February 7, 2020) | Reply
Post ID: @OP+JICd4mz

43 replies (most recent on top)

That's a lengthy post

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @jGznl+JICd4mz

It only tells one thing. You are a bad at managing things.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @7gml+JICd4mz

Every time layoffs happened and they missed me, I thought "phew, dodged a bullet there". This time, I got laid off, and thought "phew, dodged a bullet there."

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @7vhv+JICd4mz

I disagree with a couple of things the OP is trying to make up with false premises:

"Often, they were simply people who did not perform well in the last year only." : Not necessarily, managers used 360s to get rid of people who they didn't like, or didn't align with their shenanigans. Managers will exaggerate things put by the backstabber colleague to give SSL4s to those targeted.

"All of this happened, because nobody knew that SSL 4 would imply getting an ISP." Not true, the ISP/VSP in 2015 showed that SSL4 was used to put you on the verge of getting VSP/ISP. I heard from recent hires that managers told them not to worry as layoffs won't apply to them even if getting SSL4, but their older colleagues.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @4mov+JICd4mz

Probably the best thread here

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @4mgo+JICd4mz

Unfortunately, @3tmk, moving to a new team is exactly what one shouldn't do at Intel these days. You end up scr3wed. Intel really needs to think long and hard at the problems they've created with all their variations of ACT. They are losing highly experienced, very good employees when in reality, handpicking the crap is what should happen. That way the REAL issues end up leaving the company, not those that were spit out by some stupid algorithm. It's very sad to watch what was once such a fine company about to go up in flames.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @3mbz+JICd4mz

@JICd4mz-3gbu. That is exactly what happened to me. Got the requisite EEs over time, was due for a promotion, and then that was the year PSO froze promotions. Then I got reorg'd and was in a new team where I was at the bottom of the rankings. Moreoever, the team was very small and was full of rockstars the managers understandably wanted to retain and reward--I was the least of their priorities. So after 4 years of Successful and SSL3, I was now 'stagnant' and got the VSP. It is hard to bend that mandatory bell curve on small teams full of really bright players and somebody had to go. It was me.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @3tmk+JICd4mz

I'd like to also add one more thing... the OP mentioned how FLM need to have a strategy or game the system in order to retain their good employees. This would careful planning and distributions of promotions, raises, lower stock levels.. the idea is that over time, everyone will get what they deserve due to all the earmarks being in place.

The problem with that, and why some go without promotions for 3+ years, completely out of the control of the employee and their FLM, is that there have been so many re-orgs, restructurings, and attrition (sometimes good managers could sense dark days ahead and decided to jump ship ahead of time) that continuity has been a problem.

Picture having a manager that you've worked with for 2 years on a dev plan and you've been told that you're on track for promo next year. Then a re-org hits or for one reason or another you get a new manager and/or get moved to a different team, in many cases you've effectively just had your dev plan thrown into the toilet and flushed down the drain, causing you to have to start over with a new manager.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @3gbu+JICd4mz

FLM - good post. Refreshingly genuine. Sounds legit enough to be.

I know some good people in Chandler that were asked to relocate or be out of a job. These were experienced, high performers, not people you would consider to be VSP/ISP material or even near the chopping block.

It's precisely the decisions of higher level managers or executives that has triggered harmful attrition at Intel, caused by Intel "leaders" using a hacksaw when a precision scalpel is what is really needed. As a result, some star-level engineers I know left Intel as a result. Some went to Microsoft, others to Apple. In all cases, fortunately, they wound up in better places and in better situations than they were at Intel, getting paid considerably more. In a way, Intel did those folks a favor while at the same time kicking itself in the nuts. They're going to feel the pain for quite some time. You don't simply bring in new hires and expect things to keep rolling as they did before. For one thing, they lack the historical context to compare now to an earlier time, to know whether things are trending up or down. And it also means they don't know what's been tried, what works and what doesn't. So they may end up re-inventing the wheel or going down a path that is likely doomed to repeat history and failure. Further, they don't know the specifics about stakeholders and key partners and how to best engage each individual optimally. These are things that are developed over years...

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @3bes+JICd4mz

Thank you for this post. Very genuine. I was ISPed this year and all along I thought my manager was biased against me. Maybe like you he had no choice. However, I am not anywhere near retirement. I have found a job but the salary is half of what I made at Intel ( which wasn't very high to begin with). I know I was productive at Intel but maybe management thought otherwise.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @2zjp+JICd4mz

@JICd4mz-1iuc. You can also recognize the Time Will Tell Troll as being non-native English speaker by his/her misuse of grammar and certain words. Probably in India.

This is the best thread in this forum in a long time except for Time Will Tell and the Emoji Trolls.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @2xmf+JICd4mz

Great post, OP sounds like he/she was one of the better FLM's at Intel. I was fortunate to have many others like him who were open and direct (I took ERP). As for the trolls on this post, probably all still Intel employees who are frustrated they don't have a clue and really need those of us that did back to do their work for them and realize they now will be the ones to blame for Intel's ultimate failure into oblivion.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @2hdm+JICd4mz

So I did not give an EE to another team member who really would have deserved it, but instead I used my promo budget to give him a higher raise (which made him happy) and marked him as a definite candidate for EE next year. But now he got a VSP because of that and left.


One very hard, honest worker, by clueless/ignorant manager (who gets for this $300K USD overall package per annum), got shot in the head. Most of you here, do you really care? No, you don't!

Many very hard, honest workers. by ignorant and arrogant executive management (who get for this $millions USD overall package per annum) got shot in the heads. Most of you here, do you really care? No, you don't!

INTEL, as it is now, will not survive till Y2020. It will downsize, with 70K+ employees to go. Most of you here, do you really care? Oh, YES, you will care!

Time Will Tell

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @2tyb+JICd4mz

Now you tell me. {sigh} oh well.

As Cypher said, "Ignorance is Bliss".

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @2urb+JICd4mz

@1iuc - I've got both of those in my troll list. This is one of the best threads I've seen in a while and both of those azzwipes are disrupting the valuable info/discussion. Would be good to know if there is a provision for #admin to ban well-known trolls from the board. #admin has certainly been busy as of late deleting a bunch of threads.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1wmm+JICd4mz

Everyone: @JICd4mz-1cnk aka "Time Will Tell" is a well-known troll. Then there is that annoying Emoji Troll...@JICd4mz-awo

Wouldn't it be funny if both were from HR? Although, candidly, I assume the trolls aren't even related to Intel layoffs. Just trolls.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1iuc+JICd4mz

It was always a frustration to see that many in Intel management lacked the ability to differentiate between those who produce and those who BS. Thanks to OP's post I see that some of it is institutional. It doesn't, however, explain how do-nothing BSers still continue to be propped up and even promoted to levels well beyond their skill level. Allow me to do that now -- The continuous performance management process is a farce. I was never asked to provide input on peers or bosses, and no one else I know was asked either. Lacking full 360 input and the cross checks that come from alternative input, what's left is subjectivity, cronyism, and whoever has the power to wield them.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1ijo+JICd4mz

1cnk - "Time Will Tell" trollie, back under your bridge.

OP was just being honest and straightforward. Thanks for sharing your useful insight, don't listen to the stupid comments from "Time Will Tell" maggot.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1anb+JICd4mz

Thanks OP for a considered and good post.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1gmo+JICd4mz

Listen, you c----roach... OP! You think you've been honest? Hey, buddy, we, so average minions... We are here to clean up YOUR (FLMs) mistakes, you idiot! You are clueless what is really going on below you, since you are (after all) trying to protect your a--! Kapish?

Who really trusts you? Your staff? C'mon, get real! You were NOT chosen to be manager for what you wrote here... You were chosen, since they (masters) have good judgement that you are weak personality, and you'll follow madness of the upar layers?!

We, minions, should NOT to trust to anyone, even peers, since the Company (INTEL) is so poisoned, from top do down... Rotten, on all levels. And you are rotten too. But, they now squeezed your b.a.l.l.s, so you can do Mission Impossible.

Listen, FLM moron, you do what they want, or die. No other choice, since you purged (no matter why) people of essential value to the Company.

Were you honest, after all? Stand in front of mirror, and look at yourself??? Were you? Please, find answers between your lines, you corrupt jack-a--.

Time Will Tell

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1cnk+JICd4mz

I agree with OP. I got an Intel offer in 2004, grade 9, mid range, when the economy was pretty good in the Bay Area. My pay put me above my peers who had same years of experience but had been with Intel for 10+ years, including my FLM. Needless to say, even though I was a high contributor in all my 12 years, no promos, only Successful with S3 stocks. Until this year, my first S4 and I was out. And yes, all of my peers and FLM are Indians and I was not. I thought the lack of ethnic diversity in my group would have spared me, but I was wrong. I have new job with lower comp now, but I am ok with it since I had made $2.5M with Intel already.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1rui+JICd4mz

As the OP said, promoting your employees to the next grade level is a multi-year strategic plan that the FLM has to work out, its almost impossible to promote a person with an "S", so you need to allocate >S. And there are always more people overdue for a promo than promos that can be achieved. Secondly, to reward someone with stock level 1 or 2, usually means producing someone at stock level 4. The option is to either peanut butter so everyone is 'average', or do some form of recognition of the highest contributors, driving the pressure to generate an SL4 to balance the stock allocation budget. At the time FLMs made these decisions, the criteria for ISP was not revealed. I think most FLMs truly are trying to promote and reward their most significant contributors but the focal tool and its budget structure limit the choices that can be made.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1ivj+JICd4mz

This is an excellent thread, thank you OP. And it's all true, based on input from several FLMs I knew. I can't add much more except that I am still incredulous that the result of the SL4 was immediate walking out of incalculable knowledge, none of which was passed on to remaining FLMs or team members. That will be a beautiful college case study for years to come.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1ysd+JICd4mz

The OP is 100% true.

If anyone thinks that Intel is led well, managed well or has an effective performance management system, they're high.

The past, present and future failures of Intel in the marketplace are a manifestation of these problems in its culture. Sadly, BK and so many senior Intel leaders know no better because they've never worked elsewhere nor do they believe in or participate in the leader and manager development that could bring enlightenment.

ACT was a fiasco that has and will cripple Intel for years. Many of the brightest people at Intel are looking elsewhere or have left on their own. Others feel trapped. They've worked only at Intel and are scared that their skills and power-base won't transfer (in some cases, they're right). All I know is that I'm happy to be out of that shirt hole and on to better things with a much better quality of life!

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1nhc+JICd4mz

Managers where well aware. Don't BS people. It happened in 2015. Many VPs were pushing to get more SSL4 this year. Coincidence? No manager question why? Don't play dumb on this. Since BK started there has been personnel reductions every year. OP good luck in your search at least you had the decency to quit.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1xvv+JICd4mz

@JICd4mz-1buq Just ask the poor guys in TMG working on 14nm and 10nm and 7nm. They are looking at 7 days a week 365 days a year daily TF. The schedule is like war, and some get fired even after working like that because they are at the "bottom" of the bell curve. You don't see that even in the elite military teams... but "everyone meets distribution" even LTD!

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1tbe+JICd4mz

every team has to be rated on a bell curve

I can confirm OP on this. A couple of years ago my team worked 12-16 hour days for 2 months, some only taking 1-2 days off during that entire time (no weekends, thru Xmas). It eventually slowed to 10-12 hour days but the entire year was a hellhole of stress and the entire team worked many miracles to finally get a product out. Also, about 3 months in we found out that the group was exiting our site and we were all to be redeployed at the end of the project. Great working conditions I tell you, but I'll be damned if we didn't deliver big time. I should add, none of the problems were our fault, but instead of pointing fingers we hunkered down and got it working.

After that year of stress and major sacrifice, not to mention loyalty to stay on and finish the project with the axe over our throats, you'd think that the company would take care of us to say thanks. Nope. One of the managers got mad about it and leaked the focal breakdown. I've known this manager a while, he's honest and I trust him, plus I verified as much as I could and he was never wrong. When you've gone through that type of hell with somebody and got a S+SSL3 for it you're happy to complain if someone asks.

The breakdown was 2 EE's (+ promos), 1 IR (he deserved it), and about 14 Successful + SSL3's. Nobody but the 2 EE's even got extra freakin stock.

I learned a lot about this company after that. Hopefully typing this out is worth it and others can learn too. OP is 100% correct.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1qqe+JICd4mz

@JICd4mz-1uig well I relate and can tell you I got my first level 4 in 20 years, floored, shocked... I know another 20 year veteran who got his first for being 9 months in a totally new function. The algorithm for this and focal in general is very perverted. It was a high stress for a few weeks but found out many of us like you mentioned very highly desired, every company I interviewed with made me an offer and finally just got tired and stopped. Of course the new job requires uproot / relocation which is very disruptive to the family but now in a far better place, better management, better WL"B" Balance , not Effectiveness as we have a life and our management and company respect that unlike many at Intel who have neither. Very happy to be out of that dead end hell hole!

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1buq+JICd4mz

Intel focal performance is a political game. We all know it. After ACT, it is clear if you want stay in Intel, improve your skill for it. Sadly, lots of true innovative mind engineers are low on this political skill.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1yav+JICd4mz

Of the 2015 and 2016 ISP, I know 13 who received the ISP. More took ERP and VSP. With that said, of the 13 ISP, 9 are working for other high tech companies (most were software engineers). 4 Microsoft, 2 Apple, 2 Google, and 1 Nike. All are at or above the level grade/pay wise they were in at Intel. They love their jobs and are enjoying life. The other 4 ISP, 2 retired for good, 1 went to work as a public school teacher, and the other is still looking for work.

The moral of this story is Intel called these people "Performance" issues, but most of them proved Intel was incorrect. I wonder if Intel has done a study and analyzed the ISP actions they have taken? If they are calling, let's say, 40% of the ISP "Performance" issues and they are not....then Intel clearly has a management issue. A severe management issue if that's the case. If Intel is not studying the effects of what they are doing they will not know if their actions are working. That is unless the real action was to layoff older workers with higher pay so they can bring in younger cheaper labor.

If either of those two scenarios are happening Intel may have real issues for the next 6 to 10 years.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1uig+JICd4mz

This is one of the best posts I've read here, EPIC! #GOLD

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1vji+JICd4mz

@1hxt

Can you explain how time in grade affects the rating and stock offering?

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1lrh+JICd4mz

Darling @1yzh ,

I am not viewing this on the phone 🙈😔😐 ...rarely do.

Amount to read remains the same. I'll save reading all that for when I need to snooze.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1bbc+JICd4mz

The best post ever - pure #gold

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1epx+JICd4mz

@JICd4mz-1tkj surfing on your phone, LOL, this is a great post, pay attention!

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1yzh+JICd4mz

The whole focal system while great in principle decades ago has been corrupted to the core.

These days it is viewed with huge disdain every December we get the low down on budget, and all the managers know the drill and desire for "efficiency" and we MUST hit the numbers. Anybody who believe there is't a quota is a fool, every GM has to hit it, this means every SLM needs to, and thus every FLM. Of course if the GM/VP knows how to get their because he "knows" all the marginal people than maybe you don't need to produce the "exact" number of L1/L2/L4/L5 IR and by grade and time in grade and all those other good HR metrics in the system.

Then you got the good focal tool that allocates money.. there is no personal human element in the most important of things, development of the people.

The military / government probably does a better job than Intel. In the five companies I've been I've never seen a company where HR and focal and was treated with such carelessness and LTD is the worse.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1hxt+JICd4mz

Too bad there are too many words and no pictures for you @1tkj. It was a pretty good post and worth a read.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1zbu+JICd4mz

These laid off people without any work or life ...

...have too much time on their hands to write long-a$$ essays I got no time to read ... 😴💤💤💤

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @1tkj+JICd4mz

Appreciate the well-articulated post. It explains a lot.

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @axq+JICd4mz

yawn 😴😴💤💤💤

by
| | Reply
Post ID: @awo+JICd4mz

Post a reply

: